30 replies to this topic

[4thgenFolsomite]

No, just using quotation marks for emphasis - a lot of folks assume that the presence of a bike lane means that's where a bicyclist must be no matter what and it's just not true.

Tony clearly stated the exceptions that are allowed by law, otherwise the law says bike riders must stay in the bike lane.

[TruthSeeker]

the need to come to a full stop is just silly in my view - I do it in a car to avoid a ticket and because (more importantly) it's not as easy to see some hazards from inside a car, but two-wheeled vehicles provide so much more exposure and visibility to the environment it just isn't necessary in some cases.

wow, unbelievable

Guess we can count you as one of those bicyclists who won't stop at any stop signs. Please don't blame anyone but yourself when you get hit by a car.

[tony]

how did you get it to cut and paste?

I didn't do anything special, just highlighted and right clicked. You may have been on a different web site; the CVC shows up more than one place. Here's where I took if from: http://www.dmv.ca.go...d11/vc21208.htm

[tony]

Personally I think folks over-obsess about this...car bike collisions at 4-way stops are quite rare, and the need to come to a full stop is just silly in my view - I do it in a car to avoid a ticket and because (more importantly) it's not as easy to see some hazards from inside a car, but two-wheeled vehicles provide so much more exposure and visibility to the environment it just isn't necessary in some cases. So long as the person with the right of way gets it and folks are using common sense I don't stress about it.

Some jurisdictions enforce "stop as yield" rules, which allow you to slow down on a bike as you approach a stop sign, see that no cars, pedestrians, etc. are there and then proceed without stopping. It's efficient, easy, and just as safe really.

I generally agree that the Idaho stop is workable, but it doesn't happen to be the law in CA, and given how much antipathy there is towards cyclists, I try to be especially scrupulous about coming to a complete stop (which, BTW, does not necessarily mean putting a foot down) if there are any cars at or approaching the intersection, and make a nearly complete stop (sub 5 mph) if there is no-one else at the intersection. Then, of course, you run into the opposite problem, in which the motorist who got there first waits and insists you go out of turn; annoying, but I've learned to accept the good intentions and go with it as long as it's not causing conflict with other vehicles at the intersection.

As far as I know, Idaho is still the only place with the bikes treat stop signs as yield signs law. There are good arguments for and against it.

[Darth Lefty]

I try to be especially scrupulous about coming to a complete stop (which, BTW, does not necessarily mean putting a foot down)

For what it's worth, I find the track standing far more annoying than blowing the stop sign.

[tony]

For what it's worth, I find the track standing far more annoying than blowing the stop sign.

A true (motionless) track stand is a beautiful thing; when it starts turning into small circles, not so much. but, either way, it is your prerogative to be annoyed. However, I was talking about instantaneous stops, which are all that is required much of the time, even if other vehicles are at the intersection.

[Barb J]

Same 4 way stop today, different bicyclist just blew on through at a very high rate of speed. He could not have stopped had a car already been proceeding through the intersection. So frustrating to now have seen this two days in a row!

Barb J

[TruthSeeker]

Same 4 way stop today, different bicyclist just blew on through at a very high rate of speed. He could not have stopped had a car already been proceeding through the intersection. So frustrating to now have seen this two days in a row!

Barb J

Sad thing is the cyclist would probably sue after being hit by a car caused by his own stupidity for blowing thru the stop sign

[ducky]

Another reason for cyclists to follow the stop sign rule is they are a danger to people trying to cross streets. If the vehicle stops, but the bike zips through, it's a hazard.

[Dr.P]

there is definitely a huge issue with the right of way mannerism. I have had motorists that won't wait their turn if I come to a full stop at a stop sign. Folks, please come to a COMPLETE FULL STOP at stop signs. you would get a big Thank You from us!!

[monstermovie]

Hi, my name is MonsterMovie, and I roll through stop-signs on my bicycle sometimes. I'll pause for a moment here for the heaping of the scorn...

 

So, blowing through a stop-sign without touching the brakes is a clear and simple foul. It's dangerous and performed by people that unfortunately feel invincible. Puts all cyclists in a bad light. Shame on them and a pox on their progeny. 

 

Two reasons I roll through stop signs sometimes: momentum and I'm a little lazy. Even though I spend an exorbitant amount of money on my bikes, get up crazy-early and log miles and miles and hours of hours sitting on a tiny little seat all in the name of health and fitness, losing all that hard-won momentum in order to come to a complete stop at a stop sign just isn't in my DNA. When I'm riding I can't just step on a gas pedal to get back up to speed - it takes quite a bit of effort to get back up to 15-20 mph, especially from a dead stop. "Ridiculous" you say: since I'm out to get in shape anyway I should welcome the interval-style acceleration that comes from a complete stop. True - that's where that laziness comes in. Sorry. 

 

If I have time to assess an intersection, not put anyone in danger or make someone miss their turn, I'll roll through a stop sign. I'll slow down for sure and scan very hard. But, if everything looks good (no people, bikes cars about to enter), I'll roll through - even in the sight of other cars (you've probably seen me and heaped scorn). I've been hit by a 30+ mph car while cycling (completely their fault) - it'll ruin your day for sure. Cyclists always lose in a car/bike collision so I make VERY sure I'm not going to get tagged - or cut a car off (to many freaks behind the wheel out there). 

 

It's funny, and I laugh at myself, because when I'm behind the wheel of the car I'm sometimes offended when I see a bicyclist not come to a complete stop. It's that whole car-superiority complex that everyone more or less gets when they get behind the wheel. And if you are that rare, perfectly egalitarian driver with no sense of entitlement when behind the wheel, I applaud your advanced evolution. 

 

So, when you see a cyclist rolling a stop sign, as long as they didn't blow through it or put you or others in danger, just say to yourself "That poor lazy fool, breaking the law in the name of momentum". And then yell "Hi, MonsterMovie!!!"

[TruthSeeker]

As long as you don't cry foul or sue the driver who runs you over while illegally blowing a stop sign - it's all good.

[monstermovie]

@TruthSeeker: No, if they "blow" the stop sign recklessly, maliciously, without regard or drunk while I "roll" the stop sign, I'll get all up in their mix with some litigiousness - for sure!

 

Also, while driving an automobile, I do come to a complete stop at stop signs.

[ducky]

I don't think it's a matter of "Why do cyclists get to do it and motorists don't?"  For some of us "freaks" that shake our heads when we see stupid moves, it's because we've seen the preventable and avoidable aftermath because rules of the road weren't followed.

[monstermovie]

I don't think it's a matter of "Why do cyclists get to do it and motorists don't?"  For some of us "freaks" that shake our heads when we see stupid moves, it's because we've seen the preventable and avoidable aftermath because rules of the road weren't followed.

Well, Ducky, that happens regularly and for myriad reasons while on the road or trail (the shaking of the head thing): whether biking, walking or driving, there's scads of unsafe happenings out there. I can't believe how many drunk drivers leave old town Folsom at 1:00am every weekend night and end up on the Folsom Telegraph police blotter! WTF are they thinking?!

And, Ducky, I'm certain you're not one of the "freaks" I'm referring to. You don't have anger issues that may cause you to use your car as a weapon for vengeance or retaliation purposes. Or are you?