343 replies to this topic

[Tugboat]

That'd be my guess too

Especially when saying he/she is an open minded person and won't jump to conclusions but in a prior post wrote this...

"I'm sure the true fault is a women more interested in talking on the cell phone then watching the road. This woman didn’t yield to on-coming traffic, therefore causing the accident"

Yes DavBurr it does sound that way, sorry, I didn't mean to sound like I'm jumping to conclusion, just trying to show another side. I'm was trying to present a good argument that SPEEDING boys are not the only fault. The women bears the responsibility to OLNY proceed when it is SAFE.

Per the DMV 07.A.10(1)
You need to develop the skills to: (a) allow you to judge the
speed and distance of other vehicles at an intersection, (b)
be able to safely pick a gap or space on entering an
intersection where there is continual cross traffic, and © be
able to judge the speed and distance of oncoming traffic
when you are crossing an uncontrolled intersection.

[camay2327]

I went there after the accident and drove out from the same spot. As you cross the road to make the left hand turn, you do look right to see if anyone is coming from your right, so yes she could have looked right and slowed down before attempting to making her left turn.

Now on the other hand, just because there is a car in front of me making a left hand turn I do not plow into them. I would either stop or move over into another lane unless they were racing and there was no where else to go.

The skid marks also tell me something else. I have not mentioned it before but if you put your breaks on hard you will skid and in this case that is what happened. When you are in a skid like that you can not turn. You can turn your wheels but you will continue to skid straight forward in the direction of the skid. The only way you can turn away is to let up on your brakes briefly to allow the front wheels to turn.

This is something that you learn, it is not given to you from a book.

[Family Friend]

Everyone that knows the boys have been very sensitive in their comments. They understand that a lot of emotions are involved, that someone did die, and they are being respectful.

The boys supporters are not burying their heads in the sand and denying what happened.

We do disagree with the news reporting of what happened. While at the same time we agree with the majority of the Folsom Police Report. Unfortunately, those are two unrelated subjects.

Our only complaint with the police report is that it is only 50% finished. We think that the actions of all three drivers needs to be examined. There were three cars involved, why would you only investigate the actions of two of the cars?

The comments that the boys friends and family have made are very limited and can be summarized into a few groups.

Let the police finish their investigation.
Let's wait for all the facts to be collected.
The media story is not accurate.

and

I know these kids (away from this event) and they are not Stalin and Hitler.


How can any of those Comments offend you?

[camay2327]

They also are not Jesus or the Pope.

[Family Friend]

They also are not Jesus or the Pope.

That is my point.

Everyone is going to the extreme. Even me in that example.

They are not Stalin and Hitler on one side. Nor, Jesus and the Pope for the other side.

I will say they are somewhere in between.

[Tugboat]

They also are not Jesus or the Pope.

camay2327 you seem to have nothing but bitter closed minded statements, hanging these boys. Is that presented in just this subject or is this just your typical close minded attitude. No offence intended, just need the frame of mind of who I’m reading.

[camay2327]

If you read back, I think that I have put a lot of very informative information in here...

[Dave Burrell]

If you read back, I think that I have put a lot of very informative information in here...

One things folks need to realize - seeing a car coming at 45mph and determining its distance and speed is entirely different then trying to gauge one coming at you over 70 or 80+ mph

I'm not an expert, but based on the fact there were skid marks over 160 feet long, that is a seriously strong indication they were not going the posted speed limit

Its just amazing to me how the death of this lady is over shadowed by the concern of the boys future - guess its easy to forget that lady no longer has a future

[camay2327]

Dave, I agree with you. Thanks...

[Family Friend]

One things folks need to realize - seeing a car coming at 45mph and determining its distance and speed is entirely different then trying to gauge one coming at you over 70 or 80+ mph

I agree with you to, any reasonable person will, but the 70-80 mph speed the media has reported is not a fact in this case.

The Folsom Police shared a lot of opinions with the media that are not in the Police Report that they turned into the DA.

The Police have a video that shows the cars were not traveling that fast.

And I am not sure what the skidmarks mean. There are two different lengths involved. The Folsom Police have not turned this report in, but have shared the results to the media. I have no idea what training the Folsom Police have been given in this field. I would guess it is a very specialized field that isn't normally needed by the Folsom Police Department and that they don't have an expert on staff.

I do know that the online calculator tells me that:

If two tires leave a 166 foot skidmark - that equals 58 mph
and
If two tires leave a 80 foot skidmark - that equals 37.9 mph

That gives me an average speed of 47.95 mph - barely over the speed limit.

I can't find a calculator that let's me type in two different skidmark lengths, so I can't verify that number, and I know it can't be that simple to figure out.

I could guess a number like everyone else, or wait for the CHP to investigate and give me an expert opinion.

[DrKoz23]

That is my point.

Everyone is going to the extreme. Even me in that example.

They are not Stalin and Hitler on one side. Nor, Jesus and the Pope for the other side.

I will say they are somewhere in between.

Somewhere in between... but kids who cared more about their sound system than what just happened.

[stacycam]

I think there is really no way for us to estimate their speed, just by the skidmarks. Since the skidmarks stopped once the car collided with the woman's car, there is no way (for us) to know how long the skidmarks would have been had the driver fullly stopped. It's possible the skidmarks would have been 250 feet long, or 170. Either way, we can't really know and it is up to the experts to determine.

I think I'll just wait to see what comes of this. I hope if the boys are found to be at fault, they suffer some serious consequences. I don't know what the appropriate consequences are, but I sure hope it would be no license for many years. I would be VERY surprised if they were not at fault at all, given what I've heard. The degree of fault remains to be seen.

I just wonder if we'll ever hear the full story, especially since they are juveniles.

[Family Friend]

Somewhere in between... but kids who cared more about their sound system than what just happened.

There is nothing in the Police Report that changes my thoughts about the speakers. I will stick with my original statement quoted below.

In regards to the kids actions, the police report states that:

1) The first and second 911 calls were from the boys.
2) The first witnesses to arrive at the accident report that the boys got out of their car and went directly to the Solara.

There is very little information in the Police Report about the boys actions after the accident. The report is limited in scope to the Police trying to prove that the boys were racing.

Nobody, is going to defend the boys for getting their speakers out of the car if this is true. However, so many other parts of the story the media has been telling us is wrong. I am not sure if this part is accurate.

[LadyGreenEyes]

Its just amazing to me how the death of this lady is over shadowed by the concern of the boys future - guess its easy to forget that lady no longer has a future

Great post. I couldn't agree with you more.

[old soldier]

its kind of a fact of life that the press likes to get the most exciting story cause thats what makes news. its more exciting when a tragedy like this is caused by kids racing that if the lady was hit by a soccer mom late for practice or and old senior citizen motoring along not paying a lot of attention.

the speaker story suggests the kids didn't care and with folks knowing kids and speed are sometimes connected the first reaction is against them

the one interesting thing which folks haven't talked about if the solara did get hung up in the second lane maybe cause folks were coming up iron point where she wanted to turn. a lot of bad things happen with left hand turns

as the court process plays out we can be sure the answer will come out cause there will be some smart attorneys making sure the facts are right.

too bad we don't live in the world of the 24 tv show. our police folks could have called Jack Baur and he would have had Cloie program the satalite and we would have the accident shown as it really hppened.