52 replies to this topic

[Steve Heard]

New Girl

More of us go through this stuff than you realize. I spoke with the parent of some other kids I know. We remarked that now that our kids are maturing, they're staying out of trouble, and we (the parents) don't to see each other any more.

She said she'll have her son bring a knife to school, and I promised to have my daughter run away. I kid, I kid.

Point is, you are not alone. Not only are kids difficult to raise, but in this town, there are so many different forces working against them.

Continuation and alternative education are often encouraged by teachers and administrators, because the high-school is already over crowded, so it is a way of thinning out the herd.

We've got rich kids with cars, and money to burn. Poor kids with angry, absent or otherwise neglectful parents.

A police force without the resources to address teen drug issues.

A lot of parents with their heads in the sand, not wanting to face the issues of drug and alcohol abuse.

All of these forces combined confuse our kids and make it easy for them to stray, despite your best efforts. Don't give up, though. Alway support, guide and remain in their corner.

Don't compromise your values.

[CostcoLover]

We all have to do some things we'd rather not do.

Things I'd rather not do.....

List 'A'

Wake up before 10am
Go to work - any work!
Work out
Eat well
Run errands
Grocery shopping
Drive
Turn the compost
Dig
Mow lawn
BBQ

Unfortunately, my chauffeur, butler, maid, housecleaner, personal shopper, etc... were all in a bus on the way to my mansion when the bus went out of control killing all along in a fiery crash along with all the trust fund cash they were bringing me.

So unless I want to....

Work at a fast food join the rest of my life
Be homeless
Starve
etc...

I go do list 'A' above. Funny Steve, you and I must have the same boss, if I do 50% of my job, I too get 100% fired. Go figure.... where is continuation and alternative employment for us?

[uberman]

I believe that hanging out after school has nothing to do with my school work. It doesn't make me consentrate less, or make me do less work. I don't have homework at my school, so there is no need to be home. I can agree with my dad on spending SOME family time. But like most teenagers will say, friends are the most important thing when your my age.

Jenny, it seems to me that with these actions, notably wanting to go to Folsom Lake, you're setting yourself down a path of failure. Why anyone would want to lower themselves as opposed to challenge themselves is BEYOND me, but you chose to do it.

WANTING to go to Folsom Lake rather than take up the challenge of doing adaquetly at Folsom High is the first sign that you don't believe in yourself enough to pull your stuff together and buckle down. Graduating from Folsom High is not difficult. There are people much "dumber" than you who have done so in the past. It's not difficult, even remotely. American High Schools are the easiest to graduate from as opposed to their foreign counterparts.

The desire to "hang out" and waste your life is the primary concern I have, playing and having fun is great, but the actions you take NOW will reflect your habits for the rest of your life.

But then again, this is coming from someone who hardly ever left the house after sunset. In fact, i was expected to be home before sunset (except when going to the gym,) every night, even TO THIS DAY.

Early recognition of parenting mistakes could have prevented this Steve.

[bordercolliefan]

Early recognition of parenting mistakes could have prevented this Steve.

Uber, that seems very arrogant to me. I am glad that you are satisfied with your parents' rules and parenting techniques, and that you feel you have turned out well.

But until you have children, you will never know the complex web of factors that influence how kids turn out. Genes... disposition... parenting... peer influences... school experiences... to name just a few. The same strict approach that seemed fine for you might result in outright rebellion in another kid with a different make-up. (Those of us with 2 or more kids know that parenting contributes relatively little to a child's personality and interests).

All the evidence suggests that Steve is doing a fine job as a parent and that Jenny is on the road to turning out just fine.

I can't wait till you have children, uber -- I'm sure you'll find it a very humbling experience!

[benning]

Uber, that seems very arrogant to me.  I am glad that you are satisfied with your parents' rules and parenting techniques, and that you feel you have turned out well. 

But until you have children, you will never know the complex web of factors that influence how kids turn out.  Genes... disposition... parenting... peer influences... school experiences... to name just a few.  The same strict approach that seemed fine for you might result in outright rebellion in another kid with a different make-up.  (Those of us with 2 or more kids know that parenting contributes relatively little to a child's personality and interests). 

All the evidence suggests that Steve is doing a fine job as a parent and that Jenny is on the road to turning out just fine. 

I can't wait till you have children, uber -- I'm sure you'll find it a very humbling experience!

well said, bc -- People and parents are complex creatures. If there were a universal formula that always worked, we'd be a pretty boring society.

[Steve Heard]

Jenny, it seems to me that with these actions, notably wanting to go to Folsom Lake, you're setting yourself down a path of failure. Why anyone would want to lower themselves as opposed to challenge themselves is BEYOND me, but you chose to do it.

WANTING to go to Folsom Lake rather than take up the challenge of doing adaquetly at Folsom High is the first sign that you don't believe in yourself enough to pull your stuff together and buckle down. Graduating from Folsom High is not difficult. There are people much "dumber" than you who have done so in the past. It's not difficult, even remotely. American High Schools are the easiest to graduate from as opposed to their foreign counterparts.

The desire to "hang out" and waste your life is the primary concern I have, playing and having fun is great, but the actions you take NOW will reflect your habits for the rest of your life.

But then again, this is coming from someone who hardly ever left the house after sunset. In fact, i was expected to be home before sunset (except when going to the gym,) every night, even TO THIS DAY.

Early recognition of parenting mistakes could have prevented this Steve.

Uber

Your post was dead on until the end. No amount of parenting, good or bad, can make a child's decisions for her.

I'm not mad atcha. Your last comment is more naive than anything else. All parents I've spoken to thought they'd do things differently, and thought things would work differently than they actually did.

Intent and reality don't always meet.

Each child is different. I have a good friend who raised 3 kids in identical circumstances. 1 is a nurse. 1 is a designer. 1 is an unemployed meth freak.

I know another couple, both in the education field, with 2 kids. 1 is an A-student. The other went to Folsom Lake.

Kids choose their own paths, despite our best efforts. I wasn't going to beat my kid into having good grades. I had to just do my best with her.

You'd be surprised at all of the advice I got from other parents, experts, and even kids. Half thought I was too strict. The other half, too lenient.

Still, I'm not perfect. I've made many mistakes as a parent, and continue to do so.

Many of you know that I am heavily involved in the Folsom Healthy Families Forums. We address the issue of drug and alcohol abuse among Folsom kids.

Through this association, I've met cops, counselors, school officials, and a bevy of experts, victims, parents and quite a few people in recovery.

Many of us look for reasons why kids make bad decisions, and parents surely have to take some responsibility for their child's behavior, but in the end, the kid has to make decisions.

[benning]

Not to defend uberman but I think this is what he was referring to when he came down on Steve.

Not wanting to sound harsh myself, it does surprise me that this continued to this point, from 6th grade to your senior year in high school is a long time for this to go on. I personally think in your later years Jenny, you might regret this decision, you can never get your senior year back and all the things that go with it. Also, it sets you back if you do go to college what you don't take in high school you might have to take there.

Interestingly enough, performance/interest in school is one thing that kids have 100% control over. You can force them to study and do homework but they can still underperform to their heart's desire. Kids will always win this battle with parents.

The fact that she said it was a mistake is something to celebrate.

[BlueStateMom]

Jenny,
I enjoyed reading your post. Your thoughts are well presented, and you seem so charming. Please bear with me as I fight my "pushy mom" urge to scream...It's so obvious - she's destined to be a writer!!
One question...What do you really love to do? What are you passionate about? I understand that you'll be working in addition to school now, but if you can make some time to try to focus on something you really enjoy (maybe a dance class, rowing lessons on Lake Natoma, a web-design class at FLC, one thing my son really loved was a series of teen cooking classes down at Whole Foods...who knew?). How about keeping a journal of your experiences this year, and compiling them for one of those end-of-the-year reviews the SacBee does on local high-school kids? Since most of us are unfamiliar with the continuation school experience, we'd learn something, and my pushy-self would be thrilled to see you published!
You have tons of potential, and family and friends who love and support you, so you're among the truly blessed. Make the most of your gifts this year. We all wish you the best!

[OctoberLily]

Steve, it sounds like your daughter knows what she needs to get done this year and is working towards completing her goals.

From what I've read of your posts in the past couple years, you sound like you are an active participant in your child's life. That's a great thing!

By the way, I spoke with my sons and they said it is not unusual for Seniors to have 3 hours of lecture their Senior year. In fact, my oldest had 3 hours lecture and then 2.5 hours of ROP (law enforcement at Del Paso and Intern at Dept. of Justice). He, too, didn't have a lot of homework except for the dreaded Senior project which took a lot of his time.

He also knew someone who graduated from Folsom Lake after only 3 years of high school and went on to a really good college. The perception that continuation school is lousy is inaccurate. This girl apparently "hated everyone at the high school and all the drama that came with it" so she asked her parents if she could go to continuation school. He said that students have more control of their schooling there. They can either do as much work as possible (as this girl did and she graduated early) or as little work. You get credit for what you do. It really puts a lot more responsibility on the kids.

[Steve Heard]

Jenny,
I enjoyed reading your post.  Your thoughts are well presented, and you seem so charming.  Please bear with me as I fight my "pushy mom" urge to scream...It's so obvious - she's destined to be a writer!!
One question...What do you really love to do?  What are you passionate about? I understand that you'll be working in addition to school now, but if you can make some time to try to focus on something you really enjoy (maybe a dance class,  rowing lessons on Lake Natoma, a web-design class at FLC, one thing my son really loved was a series of teen cooking classes down at Whole Foods...who knew?).  How about keeping a journal of your experiences this year, and compiling them for one of those end-of-the-year reviews the SacBee does on local high-school kids?  Since most of us are unfamiliar with the continuation school experience, we'd learn something, and my pushy-self would be thrilled to see you published!
You have tons of potential, and family and friends who love and support you, so you're among the truly blessed.  Make the most of your gifts this year.  We all wish you the best!

That was one sweet response. Jenny hasn't been on in a couple of days, but I'll make sure she checks in, tomorrow.

She IS a great writer, isn't she? Lots of potential there, and so expressive. It is an art, and she is a natural.

I'll never forget (though I've forgotten her screen name), when she logged on to myfolsom to defend gays and illegal immigrants (a natural liberal!). One of the moderators posted on the moderator forum that we needed to watch out for this new person, who might be a trouble maker.

They all had a good laugh when I told them to relax, it was my then 14 year old daughter.

She is a sweetie, and will be quite a woman.

[OctoberLily]

I also have to agree with your wife on the issue of making your daughter stay home every day after school and not hang out with friends as much. That is a little harsh.

Looking back on my senior year, spending as much time with my friends was very important to me because I knew that it would be the last year we would all be together before college separated us. After graduation, who knew when we would see each other again.

In fact, I see my sons expressing the same importance to time spent with their friends. Most of my oldest son's friends have already left for college and the rest are leaving this week. It's kind of a sad time for them because the friends they have had for 6 years are all leaving town for college. They, too, don't know when or if they will see each other again.

My youngest is now a Senior at FHS and he also works. With school, work and friends, he has expressed the need to spend time with his friends. I decided to up his curfew from 11:30 pm to 12 midnight. (His friends all have later curfews (1am/2am) but I think midnight is a good time. It is right before the bars close and the drunks come out.)

My parents were very strict while I was a teenager (no makeup, 10am curfew, no boyfriends) which really caused me to rebel quite a bit. (I joined the military right after high school and left the country for overseas duty at 18 yo. I knew no one in Japan. It was scarey!)

If you trust that your child is smart (and she sure sounds like it), if she knows right from wrong, and has been a good kid, then it's important to meet her half way, because doing otherwise and caging her in - in an attempt to protect her- might have the opposite affect you want.

Give her room to branch out and spread her wings before she actually is out on her own. It could teach her to have confidence in herself when the time comes where she is actually out on her own and in college.

I hope this helps. It's tough watching your babies grow up and not want to spend time at home. I totally understand your desire to protect your child. I have the same feelings with mine.

By the way, I - too - check myspace so don't feel too bad.

[uberman]

Your post was dead on until the end. No amount of parenting, good or bad, can make a child's decisions for her.

Steve, I apologize for that remark, I was planning on editing and erasing it realizing how dumb that sounded (and consequently is,) I hope you accept my apology.

However, the computer geek in me has to say: naive is spelled: naïve. Otherwise it's pronounced "na∙ve"

[uberman]

I can't wait till you have children, uber -- I'm sure you'll find it a very humbling experience!

Sometimes I let my pride get the best of me, sorry for talking as if I know something about parenting, I'm sure it will be a humbling experience

[CostcoLover]

Sometimes I let my pride get the best of me, sorry for talking as if I know something about parenting, I'm sure it will be a humbling experience

You can count on it...