70 replies to this topic

[OctoberLily]

This is really sad news. I feel bad for this girl and her family.

Unfortunately, I think people are jumping to conclusions about the Folsom men. What people have said so far is merely gossip and the need to blame someone for this tragedy.

People ask how these kids could get a hold of alcohol. Well, it's very easy when you are staying in a resort or hotel. The alcohol, etc. are stocked in the room's refrigerator.

When I was 16 yo, I went to Hawaii for a Spring Break with several friends and a brother. The condo we stayed in was stocked to the 9's with wine, beer, soda, etc.

People need to wait for the investigators to do their job before they start gossiping about these kids and blaming them for someone's death and calling foul play.

When kids are away from their parents, they do some really stupid things - this includes promiscuity, drugs, alcohol, and wild behavoir. How do you think that sicko producer could make millions selling "Girls gone Wild" tapes on t.v.?

Anyways, I'm with John... let's not gossip when "we" are not privy to the evidence and investigation of this tragic death.

[Folsomite]

More details:

It's been announced that her Blood alcohol level was .18 - that is considerable. That much alcohol in your system - yeah, getting sick is not out of the question.

She also had consentual sex with one of the boys - would explain why she was naked. They were probably hammered, had sex, passed out, and then she had to vomit and probably lost her balance. I could very much see that happening.

It's a tragic and incredibly sad thing. I wish it upon nobody. I feel terrible for that whole town.

[EDF]

We aren't gossiping... this is in the papers... and the reporters are giving you some of the details they gleaned from the police...

One of the things that struck me was the height of the railing... in the news articles.. I forget if it was the Honolulu or Jersey paper..., they indicated that the railing was about chest high on the detective and he is 6'1"... so he was saying she would have had to climb it... she wouldn't have leaned over and fallen... so what happened..? was she pushed or did she get high and climb up on it and do that "Titanic" wing thing...

No one really knows.. the boys could have just passed out...and she was still awake...

I had not heard about the blood alchohol amount... but .18 is pretty high...

we'll have to wait and see.. but it ain't over... yet....!!!!

[zach5]

something still really sound fishy about that, a 4 ft high railing(or so) is hard to get over, not to mention accidentilly fall over.

[OctoberLily]

GOSSIP: "I am out of theis forum if it's going to be sensored....Their names were printed already, and anyway who cares about their reputations. A girl is dead. Come on..the girl was found naked. And no matter how drunk you have ever been in your life, do you really think you might have been drunk enough to "fall" off a nine story balcony and besides I doubt that she was just out on the balcony, naked and looking over the side and slipped. I honestly think their is foul play..."

I think "Jama" is out of line. She is basing her opinions on news that are inadequate or incomplete and with that she is going to publicly slander people on this website. For the record, my kids know one of the kids named in the newspaper for which "Jama" is insisting on naming on this forum. They say from their experience with this Folsom kid, he is a good kid, never got into trouble in school, athletic, well known with the other students, etc. They also say he is probably traumatized by the whole thing. So maybe "Jama" or "EDF" doesn't care about the reputations of these kids but the people who do know them DO CARE about them and hope that they are not publicly slandered because of the need for people to GOSSIP. Get all the facts before you start calling foul play and start slandering people on this forum.

Have you ever thought that maybe these kids have little brothers and sisters in your children's class and they don't want to be incorrectly labeled as brothers or sisters of murderers? Maybe they have parents who are well known in the Folsom community and are just as devastated by this news as the parents of the cheerleader who died?

Until these kids are charged with a crime, gossip is not something we should promote in this forum. Freedom of speech is one thing but slandering the good name of others is another.

Just my humble opinion.

By the way, I think SacBee will do anything to print a story. Maybe this the reason they have so many retractions in their story. Their reporters may not be getting every piece of fact necessary to make a conclusion but they are going to run the story and name names in the news because it sells.

P.S. People wonder how she could have fallen off a 4 foot railing ~ have you all considered that she may have stepped on one of the patio furnitures, lounge chair, end table, etc. to reach over the top of the railing? Anything could have happened.

[john]

thank you octoberlily - my points exactly. This is the exact reason I did not want to display their names.

[jama_75@hotmail.com]

Good for you all!! You people are so rediculous. What do you think a forum is for. Discussion.. Oh now it's called gossip. Did you sensor the gossip about Muder Burger or was that to you called discussion because it wasn't about a news event. Oh yeah and Boo Hoo I feel so bad for those drunk boys who got some, and still are alive and even more than the poor girl. If they were all drinking and the boys passed out dont you think she might have passed out too instead of being out on the deck playing on patio furniture?

[jake]

jama. why are you so pissy about it? Why do you care about their names? Is it like your personal mission to place blame for this on someone?

[EDF]

October...

there isn't one thread in this discussion where I said I didn't care about the kids... but their reputations are what you are worried about...

Well... lets see we have here.....one naked girl dead.... her clothes in their room... I personally don't believe these boys would do such a thing... but the information hasn't been released about what kinds of drugs, if any, may have been involved other than booze...

She either had to climb up on the railing or very close to it by either standing on a table or chair next to it and fallen off... or something else...

We will never know will we... but these kids will...

I think this incident should be a lesson to so called "young adults", kids really, who go off on these "junkets" with so-called chaperones and then left on their own to do what teenagers with a little freedom from home would do... go wild...! you ever seen the video's on E or MTV....

What was she doing just coming off the plane... in the hotel for a few hours at most, doing some "hot tub time".... then "pairing" off with one of the guys and going to their room.....?

By the way, do you blame her parents for hiring an attorney in Maui to get to the bottom of this story....

Just some things to ponder that's all...

[cybertrano]

Very good EDF, I like what you said.

The girl is 17 years old, it's her parents responsibility somewhere in this tragic.

[Eric]

Keep in mind that I'm not taking sides here...not my place, but I want to point out that Jama stated, "I honestly think their is foul play..." thus making it an opinion and not slander. By the way, slander is spoken, libel is printed, and this is neither. Statements such as, "she is basing her opinions on news that are inadequate or incomplete and with that she is going to publicly slander people on this website" and "get all the facts before you start calling foul play and start slandering people on this forum" could be considered defamation of character.
Again, not taking sides, just wanted to clear this up...one of those things drilled into my head in every journalism class I've taken

[Steve Heard]

Wow, everyone is so passionate about this. We don't ask that we respect the privacy of Dubya, or Kobe, or anyone else accused of wrongdoing. These guys are at the very least guilty of contributing to the delinquency of a minor, for their role in getting drunk with her. They admitted to partying with her, and state that one of them had sex with her, then both boys passed out, and they knew nothing of her disappearance. The medical examiner initially stated that there was no evidence of her having sex, so it contradicts their story.

I suppose it's possible that it happened the way they said it did, but it's more than a little fishy.

Innocent of murder or not, they, lost their right to privacy when they got drunk and naked with a minor in the first place.

Couldn't they party with someone their own age? Where the heck are morals these days?

[Chad Vander Veen]

What!?! She was 18 and the "boys" were 19 and 20. That is their own age Steve.
Though not of drinking age, these 3 people are "adults".

"Innocent of murder or not, they, lost their right to privacy when they got drunk and naked with a minor in the first place."

Really? How Stalinist of you to know where one's rights begin and end.

[Steve Heard]

Cvander

You crack me up. The courts have ruled over and over that adults accused of a crime do not have the right to expect privacy.

I saw somewhere in here that the girl was 17. Regardless, they shouldn't have been drinking.

Whether we did when we were kids is irrelevant. It's illegal, and bad things can happen.

[Chad Vander Veen]

So if decide to accuse you of a crime, I should feel free to post all the personal info I can find about you, right?