129 replies to this topic

[4thgenFolsomite]

 

I agree I'd like to see the building used.   Last time I went by it looked like some concrete had been pulled up and some work was going on.

 

Are you sure 909 Mormon St. was only used for meetings?  I do think it was used for offices by the district in the past - Health programs, GATE, and such.  I used to know someone that worked for FCUSD and her office was at the Granite Center.  I went there once to get a TB test in order to be a volunteer at the school.

 

no, I'm not sure.  Its highly likely the school district uses it because I do recall seeing cars parked there often.  No doubt you are right.  I think Bernau wants to have it for outside (non-FCUSD) use perhaps.

[ducky]

 

no, I'm not sure.  Its highly likely the school district uses it because I do recall seeing cars parked there often.  No doubt you are right.  I think Bernau wants to have it for outside (non-FCUSD) use perhaps.

 

Probably just a technicality that needs to get done, dot the i's and cross the t's kind of thing.

[Steve Heard]

When I go to old town its only to get lunch or dinner and a few beers and leave. There's nothing else to do there other then eat and drink.

 

The historic district has so much more to offer than booze and food! 

 

There's the Folsom History Museum, Pioneer Village and the Power House, where you can learn about Folsom's past.

 

There are several art galleries featuring local and nationally known artists. 

 

I can think of 3 shops selling Native American products. 

 

The Sutter Street Theater produces great plays (The Producers was hilarious)

 

The Amphitheater has occasional live bands free of charge

 

Sutter Street is the scene of many great Folsom events, including the Antique Fair, Second Saturdays, Graffiti Night, The Cattle Drive and parade, Farmer's Market, Folsom Live, Night of 1000 Pumpkins and the Christmas Tree Lighting and more. 

 

There are paths and trails along Lake Natoma perfect for a short stroll or a long hike. 

 

There are antique, jewelry, and clothing stores, a real estate office, and even a tattoo parlor. 

 

The truss bridge is a great place to hang out and watch the boaters, bikers and joggers go by. 

 

Yes, there's so much more the food and drink to be had in the historic district!  

 

 

 

Are you sure 909 Mormon St. was only used for meetings?  I do think it was used for offices by the district in the past - Health programs, GATE, and such.  I used to know someone that worked for FCUSD and her office was at the Granite Center.  I went there once to get a TB test in order to be a volunteer at the school.

 

 

I know that at one time they were using it for some district offices, particularly the health programs. I was told that it didn't meet earthquake standards and that may be the reason they moved them out.  

[ducky]

I think one of the reasons given for building the new district office was to consolidate everything in one place and I think that's why they moved.  I remember a poster here saying something that, for it to house students, it needed to meet stricter seismic requirements.  Put adults in there and call it an office and for some reason it's A-okay, I guess.  She was even inquiring here if anyone was interested in locating their church to the building.

 

On an unrelated note, has anyone else noticed how much longer the signal light takes to signal if you are waiting to cross East Bidwell at the Glenn intersection?  Why'd they change it?

[4thgenFolsomite]

I think one of the reasons given for building the new district office was to consolidate everything in one place and I think that's why they moved.  I remember a poster here saying something that, for it to house students, it needed to meet stricter seismic requirements.  Put adults in there and call it an office and for some reason it's A-okay, I guess.  She was even inquiring here if anyone was interested in locating their church to the building.

 

On an unrelated note, has anyone else noticed how much longer the signal light takes to signal if you are waiting to cross East Bidwell at the Glenn intersection?  Why'd they change it?

schools actually have stricter seismic standards than regular buildings because of a law passed after the Long Beach Earthquake in 1933.  I'm such a history nerd.  Had to do a job in southern california on temple school, so I know this.....

[ducky]

Just noticed Cyclone fencing has once again gone up around the unfinished mosque site on Sibley.  According to the April Planning Commission meeting minutes they have extended the development permit until October 2014, but the applicant is having trouble financing the project.  Whether it will ever be built is questionable in my opinion.

[nomad]

Just noticed Cyclone fencing has once again gone up around the unfinished mosque site on Sibley.  According to the April Planning Commission meeting minutes they have extended the development permit until October 2014, but the applicant is having trouble financing the project.  Whether it will ever be built is questionable in my opinion.

 

Meanwhile, the super dense low income apartments across from the mosque sight are rolling right along. Take a look at how many units there are and the size of the parking lot. The two don't seem to match. Unless they think none of those folks have/need cars?

[ducky]

 

Meanwhile, the super dense low income apartments across from the mosque sight are rolling right along. Take a look at how many units there are and the size of the parking lot. The two don't seem to match. Unless they think none of those folks have/need cars?

 

If there isn't enough spaces allotted, where will they park?  Usually when that happens they park up nearby streets, but there aren't any around.  I doubt there will be enough room for street parking on Sibley if and when they ever put in sidewalks and bike lanes.

[TruthSeeker]

People will always park and walk to drink or go to a dancehall. So as the daytime businesses disappear, what will likely replace them is nighttime is more adult entertainment venues. This trend has been going on a while and is increasing. Now that Yagers bldg has sold, the big antique cooperative in there has been given 60days to move. The rumor is that another powerhouse-style dance hall is planned for that upper space. Having walkable sidewalks will pale in comparison as a deterrent to families compared to a street of bars and pubs that don't open until late afternoon.

You were right about too many bars on Sutter Street. This article came out this week in the Telegraph.

FOLSOM, CA - For many, Sutter Street in historic Folsom is the go-to spot for good eating and nightlife, but for others, the bustle and action on the popular street spells trouble.

Many retail businesses along the street are dealing with what they call “a heavy saturation of bars” in the area.

According to documents obtained from the California Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control, the historic district has 18 active licenses for the on-site distribution of beer, wine, and/or liquor.

“My thought is that it’s OK to have your bars … but what’s happening is it seems like we’re losing our historic feeling,” said Rudge. “It’s just too many (bars).”

Across the busy intersection, Yvonne Norgauer, the owner of a family winery retail space and art gallery, echoed similar concerns about the number of bars on the street.

The gallery owner and vintner said her business has suffered due to the number of restaurants and full-service bars which seem to have pulled away some of her clientele.

“Business has gone down quite a bit,” said Nargauer. “These last three months have been some of the lowest I’ve had. Coincidentally, it coincides with the end of the holidays and all of these full-service bars being opened.”

Full article can be read here: http://www.folsomtel...rding-officials

[4thgenFolsomite]

You were right about too many bars on Sutter Street. This article came out this week in the Telegraph.

FOLSOM, CA - For many, Sutter Street in historic Folsom is the go-to spot for good eating and nightlife, but for others, the bustle and action on the popular street spells trouble.

Many retail businesses along the street are dealing with what they call “a heavy saturation of bars” in the area.

According to documents obtained from the California Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control, the historic district has 18 active licenses for the on-site distribution of beer, wine, and/or liquor.

“My thought is that it’s OK to have your bars … but what’s happening is it seems like we’re losing our historic feeling,” said Rudge. “It’s just too many (bars).”

Across the busy intersection, Yvonne Norgauer, the owner of a family winery retail space and art gallery, echoed similar concerns about the number of bars on the street.

The gallery owner and vintner said her business has suffered due to the number of restaurants and full-service bars which seem to have pulled away some of her clientele.

“Business has gone down quite a bit,” said Nargauer. “These last three months have been some of the lowest I’ve had. Coincidentally, it coincides with the end of the holidays and all of these full-service bars being opened.”

Full article can be read here: http://www.folsomtel...rding-officials

I hope this trend can be stopped.  there has to be balance and I worry we are already reaching a tipping point down there.  I think some of the funkier stores that are going into Palladio would have been great on Sutter Street, like the 5 and 10, for instance, that has nostalgic candies.  or the quirky shop, whatever that's called. 

[Steve Heard]

You were right about too many bars on Sutter Street. This article came out this week in the Telegraph.

FOLSOM, CA - For many, Sutter Street in historic Folsom is the go-to spot for good eating and nightlife, but for others, the bustle and action on the popular street spells trouble.

Many retail businesses along the street are dealing with what they call “a heavy saturation of bars” in the area.

According to documents obtained from the California Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control, the historic district has 18 active licenses for the on-site distribution of beer, wine, and/or liquor.

“My thought is that it’s OK to have your bars … but what’s happening is it seems like we’re losing our historic feeling,” said Rudge. “It’s just too many (bars).”

Across the busy intersection, Yvonne Norgauer, the owner of a family winery retail space and art gallery, echoed similar concerns about the number of bars on the street.

The gallery owner and vintner said her business has suffered due to the number of restaurants and full-service bars which seem to have pulled away some of her clientele.

“Business has gone down quite a bit,” said Nargauer. “These last three months have been some of the lowest I’ve had. Coincidentally, it coincides with the end of the holidays and all of these full-service bars being opened.”

Full article can be read here: http://www.folsomtel...rding-officials

 

I have mixed feelings on the bar issue. As mentioned before, I'd like more dining and shopping options, but ever since I've lived here, there've been businesses opening and folding on Sutter, and it's not because of the presence of bars. Some of the failed businesses were bars. 

 

A coffee shop with a more open feeling might do well. I like Black Rooster but it is more of a restaurant than than a linger-over-a-cup spot. 

 

As mentioned before, perhaps a grocery, a gift shop, something unique. 

 

Starlight Starbright just relocated there from Broadstone, and I'm told that 'We Olive' is going in as well.

 

As for the concern over alcohol, are people opposed to straight drinking establishments or any place that serves alcohol?

 

Do the wine shops (Wine Styles, Cellar and Wine Gallery) count?

 

What about the bars at Sutter Street Steakhouse, Hamptons and Chicago Fire?

 

I've lived  here 12 years, and I really don't know what new bars are causing the concern. Sutter Club and Folsom Hotel have been there for decades, so any problems with them are not new. Same for Powerhouse and Hacienda.  

 

Several of the newer bars actually replaced old ones; Sam Horne's (Seasons), Fat Rabbit (Pachanga, Old Europe), Lockdown Brewing Co (The Balcony, My Brother Vinny's, Lanza's).   

 

Yager's has been closed for years.

 

I don't feel unsafe on Sutter, and I do see families there during the day time. There are empty storefronts along the way that could/should be rented out by family-friendly businesses, but they aren't. 

 

For people who simply do not drink, I'm sure the bars are an issue. For those who do, it doesn't seem to be. The market gets to decide which businesses succeed and fail. 

 

I wonder what, if anything, the Historic District is doing to attract and support new and different businesses.

 

One more thing. Regarding the Wine Gallery. No offense intended to the owner, but they serve one wine label there, and exhibit only one group of artists there. 

 

If one doesn't care for their wine, one won't return. Same with the art. 

 

It seems that most of the artists, employees and customers are 60+. 

 

Don't get me wrong. I love wine, I am on the Folsom Arts and Cultural Commission, I love to support local businesses and I'm not too far from being 60, but I think the Wine Gallery would have a very limited audience and appeal even witihout new bars. 

[4thgenFolsomite]

 

 

 

As for the concern over alcohol, are people opposed to straight drinking establishments or any place that serves alcohol?

 

Do the wine shops (Wine Styles, Cellar and Wine Gallery) count?

 

What about the bars at Sutter Street Steakhouse, Hamptons and Chicago Fire?

 

I've lived  here 12 years, and I really don't know what new bars are causing the concern. Sutter Club and Folsom Hotel have been there for decades, so any problems with them are not new. Same for Powerhouse and Hacienda.  

 

Several of the newer bars actually replaced old ones; Sam Horne's (Seasons), Fat Rabbit (Pachanga, Old Europe), Lockdown Brewing Co (The Balcony, My Brother Vinny's, Lanza's).   

 

Yager's has been closed for years.

 

 

One more thing. Regarding the Wine Gallery. No offense intended to the owner, but they serve one wine label there, and exhibit only one group of artists there. 

 

If one doesn't care for their wine, one won't return. Same with the art. 

 

It seems that most of the artists, employees and customers are 60+. 

 

Don't get me wrong. I love wine, I am on the Folsom Arts and Cultural Commission, I love to support local businesses and I'm not too far from being 60, but I think the Wine Gallery would have a very limited audience and appeal even witihout new bars. 

Wow.  that's interesting.  I know a lot of the artists in the wine gallery would be pretty offended by that.  the artists that hang their art in there change it out on a regular basis and they have beautiful work in there.  Your comment about age is stunning.  I constantly see people of all ages going in there to check out the art.  And the owner does indeed pour one label: the local wine maker's.  The others on the street are really more bars than speciality wine tasting. 

 

I think your premise that "the bars have always been there" is inaccurate.  Seasons was a breakfast/lunch restaurant, not a bar.  The Balcony, My Brother Vinny's and Lanza's were also restaurants primarily and didn't cater to a late night/loud music drinking crowd.  I don't think the bars or alcohol served at the steakhouse or Chicago Fire are any problem either.  I have heard of some issues from residents in the historic district with Hampton's having late night music directed into the street as late as 1 am.  It's true that the Sutter Club, Hacienda, Powerhouse and the Folsom Hotel bar have been there for many years, but there is a new energy about them now.  They have louder music, different music and more drinking than before.  There is a certain synergy that attracts people who want to come late and drink and party.  They aren't here to go to a restaurant.  Fat Rabbit and Sam Hornes aren't part of this problem.  They balance food and alcohol and cater to a mellower crowd. 

 

I don't think the restaurant bars are creating the same issues as the late night bars, with the possible exception of the Hacienda.  If you are suggesting that the street isn't viewed by a lot a party street, then you don't know the street. 

[Steve Heard]

Wow.  that's interesting.  I know a lot of the artists in the wine gallery would be pretty offended by that.  the artists that hang their art in there change it out on a regular basis and they have beautiful work in there.  Your comment about age is stunning.  I constantly see people of all ages going in there to check out the art.  And the owner does indeed pour one label: the local wine maker's.  The others on the street are really more bars than speciality wine tasting. 

 

I think your premise that "the bars have always been there" is inaccurate.  Seasons was a breakfast/lunch restaurant, not a bar.  The Balcony, My Brother Vinny's and Lanza's were also restaurants primarily and didn't cater to a late night/loud music drinking crowd.  I don't think the bars or alcohol served at the steakhouse or Chicago Fire are any problem either.  I have heard of some issues from residents in the historic district with Hampton's having late night music directed into the street as late as 1 am.  It's true that the Sutter Club, Hacienda, Powerhouse and the Folsom Hotel bar have been there for many years, but there is a new energy about them now.  They have louder music, different music and more drinking than before.  There is a certain synergy that attracts people who want to come late and drink and party.  They aren't here to go to a restaurant.  Fat Rabbit and Sam Hornes aren't part of this problem.  They balance food and alcohol and cater to a mellower crowd. 

 

I don't think the restaurant bars are creating the same issues as the late night bars, with the possible exception of the Hacienda.  If you are suggesting that the street isn't viewed by a lot a party street, then you don't know the street. 

 

As I mentioned, being close to that age, being a lover of wine and of art, I am one of the old-timers I speak of. I've also worked there, pouring wine, and have held several events there for clients and family.  

 

I'm sure that some would be offended, but that was not my intention nor does it change the demographics. 

 

I suppose the young people could be insulted if I said I don't hang out at Hacienda on Saturday night because it's a bunch of 20 somethings drinking Fireball shots and wearing saggy pants. 

 

Yes, some younger people go into the wine gallery and some older people go into Hacienda. 

 

I know people who don't go into any of the wine places because they think wine people are snooty. I'm not offended. 

 

If you take a look at a place like the Sutter Club, you'll find that late on a Saturday night, it's 20 somethings. Go there on a Sunday at 3pm and there are regulars there in their 50's and 60's.

 

One of my daughters loves going to the Folsom Hotel on Friday or Saturday night. She's almost 25. That's her crowd.

 

I prefer Wednesday night, when Fire & Wheels holds their blues jam. My daughter calls that 'old people night'. 

 

Anyway, my point is that I don't believe that the people who would go to the Wine Gallery on a Saturday night aren't doing so any more because they now have bars available instead. 

 

As for the wine joints, they do in fact offer tastings and flights, just like the Wine Gallery, and as of a couple of years ago, the Wine Gallery is allowed to sell wine by the glass, like the bars do. 

 

Taste in wine is very personal. Some peope like particular varietals and/or particular wine makers' styles. If you are serving only one winery's wine you will limit your audience, but if you have enough of a following, you'll do okay no matter how many bars are on the street.

 

By the way, when Wayne owned the place, he closed up earlier in the evening because he said that the wine crowd doesn't stay out late and he didn't want the young party crowd coming in. I was there once when a guy came in and asked for a shot of Jack.

 

I have a great deal of respect for artists, people who take the risk of opening their own businesses, wine makers and old folks. I'm just giving my perspective. 

[tgianco]

The gallery owner and vintner said her business has suffered due to the number of restaurants and full-service bars which seem to have pulled away some of her clientele.

“Business has gone down quite a bit,” said Nargauer. “These last three months have been some of the lowest I’ve had. Coincidentally, it coincides with the end of the holidays and all of these full-service bars being opened.”

 

So, the real problem is that some of those full-service establishments offer choices that the public likes more? Am I missing something? She's lost clientele because other businesses offer more? Unless I've stopped taking my crazy pills, we're still in America (or what's left of it), right?

 

Sounds pretty NIMBY-ish to me.

[4thgenFolsomite]

So, the real problem is that some of those full-service establishments offer choices that the public likes more? Am I missing something? She's lost clientele because other businesses offer more? Unless I've stopped taking my crazy pills, we're still in America (or what's left of it), right?

 

Sounds pretty NIMBY-ish to me.

Are we bashing a struggling business owner now?  We don't even know in what context she was interviewed. 

I thought we were discussing Sutter Street.  Calm down, folks.