79 replies to this topic

[Bob]

Tessieca,

Here is another metaphor for you, “The horse is already out of the barn.” Will you and others be posting this metaphor in a few years after you have finally realized that the City’s “visioning process” was nothing more than a plan for pacifying residents into accepting continued uncontrolled development?


Only our initiative gives Folsom families direct control of their future quality of life.


We have provided numerous facts backed up by actual documents to show how unfeasible it would be for the County or Rancho Cordova to ever allow development on this land. While the uncontrolled development, business as usual side, which is opposed to real control by Folsom residents, can only parrot unsubstantiated hearsay.

The odds of any jurisdiction other than Folsom allowing development of that land is so remote that it is just irrational to weigh it against the opportunity for Folsom residents to have the real control that we deserve.

I do agree that the amount of evidence we have provided is perhaps a little overwhelming. So allow me to recap and put some key items in a nutshell:

1. Folsom will control that land. Regarding who will control the land south of 50, at least the land that immediately borders us just south of 50, the decision has already been made. It will be Folsom. The County, the City, and the State of California have all agreed that Folsom is the rightful jurisdiction. This was decided on June 6th, 2001 when the State granted the City of Folsom a Sphere of Influence (SOI) over that area.

2. The process of annexation has already begun. An SOI is THE FIRST STEP toward annexation according to the State agency that granted it. So when you hear City Hall say that they “have no immediate plans to annex that land, be aware that this is false. The process to annex was begun years ago when they started the SOI pursuit.

3. The City just doesn’t want residents “messing” in “their” business. The real reason City Hall is opposed is that they just do not want Folsom residents to interfere with “their” plans.

4. The scare tactic. The developers are trying to scare voters out of having any control so they can cut their own deal.

5. Our simple message. Sign our initiative and vote YES in November before it is too late.

Look for us at grocery stores, Target, and other venues over the next few weeks, especially on weekends, to sign our initiative. We have had great success to date but still need considerable help to meet our mid-May deadline to turn in the signatures. If you can offer help by collecting signatures at stores (we have all materials and training available) or simple by walking your neighborhood, please call.

Regards,
Bob Fish
983-2410
Folsom Residents for Sensible Growth
http://www.FolsomGrowth.org

[Bob]

Folsom Voters:

More food for thought:

From the Sacramento Business Journal article,
“Q: Why did the city cross the road? A: To get to the other side”
December 15, 2000
http://sanfrancisco..../18/focus1.html



“For instance, LAFCO's environmental analyst figured if Folsom's expansion land were developed it could generate 343,243 automobile trips a day.”


Sound like a lot of traffic adding to the already congested Highway 50 and entering into our City? It obviously is, but some think this number would be far worse. Read the following from the same article.

“How much traffic? The Sacramento Metropolitan Air Quality Management District recently disputed the LAFCO's projection that future commercial development would generate 343,230 automobile trips a day, pumping into the air daily 1.5 tons of the exhaust gasses that produce ozone.”

“The district, using updated methodology, says the project would in fact produce "several times" that amount, closer to 1 million trips a day, said Ron Maertz, the district's transportation programs manager.”


If the Air Districts numbers hold true, that means about 4.5 tons more smog per day into Folsom’s air that is already of poor quality (some of the worst in the entire Sacramento valley and, which already does not meet State and Federal air quality standards).


Regards,
Bob Fish
983-2410
Folsom Residents for Sensible Growth
http://www.FolsomGrowth.org

[tessieca]

EDF: I have not turned around. I have always been concerned about what is the best way to manage growth south of 50 in a manner that works for those of us who are directly affected.

Bob: I will certainly read the initiative before joining in or opposing it. I am not even sure if I am happy or unhappy to hear that the land closest to my home is not included in the initiative.

My main thought is to be careful for what you ask, and review the initiative with caution. I will reserve opinion until I have read it in its entirety to see if it is the panacea it's cracked up to be. While I know that people have multiple gripes about city council's development of Folsom, I really can't say that Sac. County or City of RC would be any better, and I think it would more likely be worse.

No matter who develops EDF, schools will be a concern. The Folsom Cordova district extends nearly to Rancho Murieta on the south edge. Even building ten homes across the highway will impact the school district.

[EDF]

Tessica...

yea you are right about the impact of houses on schools... that's why the "developers" should pay...

I don't want to pay for it... and you know we will... if we want to keep the "status quo"...

I don't think this is a panacea... but it sure can't be any worse than the "status quo"....

and its a red herring about the County or Rancho developing it... all you have to do is read Val's previous posts regarding the County...

[valdossjoyce]

I just heard that City Council voted to hire a San Francisco consultant to manage a "visioning process" to see what we all would want annexed area to look like.

I guess they'd rather pay big-bucks consultants (who know how to massage data) rather than just let the people speak through the ballot.

Let the developers present their vision and we will either approve or we won't. Simple. Cheap.

[Chad Vander Veen]

Here is the solution to south of 50 development... Indian Casino!

[camay2327]

I went to the city council meeting last night and this subject did come up.

They are hiring a consultant. They plan to have many, many presentations to the people of Folsom, question and answer meetings, I guess similar to what happened during the rezoning period and the new bridge.

This will give the people of Folsom a chance to interact. They also said something about at least one or two members of the city council may or might attend the meetings. I guess no more that two can attend this type of meeting at the same time due to the Brown Act.

Anyway just a few words about what went on last night. If anyone else went and can expand on this go for it.

I am all for it.

Bob, you were there. Go for it!!!

Cal

[billsfan]

valdossjoyce - I really don't understand your comments regarding a consultant? Surely a consultant would need to be involved to put together a plan for either the citizens to vote on or the council to approve. This is a very large scale project that can't just be jotted down on a few pieces of paper. This shows the council being proactive. Don't most large scale public and private projects have consultants involved during the early phases?

[EDF]

Billsfan...

I think Val's point is they are "hiring" a consultant...

I haven't read a thing as to the "cost" of this "consultant contract"...

We have some "highly paid" so called "professionals" on our city staff including 3 assistant city managers....don't we...?

Why can't we have these folks do the stinking work instead... perhaps city staff could have some "workshops" that would be convenient to Folsom Residents to take in our imput...

Its the same thing with the Water Meter issue... remember how they hired a team of consultants to explain the water meter retrofit to us Folsom Residents after the City Council hired them....?

Remember how they were "bush-wacked" at the meetings because they did not have the slightest clue how angry Folsom residents were...?

The folks at City Hall and the City Council really were out of touch on that issue.... Just like they are out of touch with this one....

This initiative is the result of the history of the "City Hall Crowd"...

"Those who don't know their history, are bound to repeat it"....

[billsfan]

I'd really like to here more about the history of politics in Folsom. I'm relatively new here, but's it apparent that there are a couple of political "camps" in the city that are opposed to each other. Is there an online location that lists previous Folsom mayors, council members, and election results?

The council indicated there would be many public meetings during the process. Developing this type of visioning process is a full-time effort that would take the city mangers away from well needed day to day efforts. Also the expertise to devlop such a proposal is usually very specialized...

[EDF]

Billsfan....

come on... these people are well paid and can do this themselves really.... or better yet... why not have the developers pay for all this...

I mean if we have to hire "out side consultants" all the time... why do we need these beaurocrats in the first place....

I don't know what "election" results is going to show you...

All you have to do is go back and start reading some of the early threads on this forum to find out what's going on in town...

and this little tidbit from a former Mayor, Bob Holderness who is a paid lobbyist/attorney for the developers metioned to me once that the reason things are happening the way they do here is because this town is so new... and since people like you weren't here "back then" you don't know what is going on....

we've already posted a website that can answer all your questions... just look for any of Bob Fish's posts and its there...

[FolsomFats]

Note to Bob Holderness-----

Bob, better watch your back. Your old lackey who served with you on the council is on the other side.

Remember the Browning 32 cal shooting the sofa, then a tire on the truck, then chasing the delivery man around the truck, firing three times at him.

Would you also inform the folks what great things Bob Fish has done for the City ? I can't remember anything except negatives.

[Terry]

QUOTE (FolsomFats @ Apr 29 2004, 06:24 PM)

Note to Bob Holderness----- Bob, better watch your back. Your old lackey who served with you on the council is on the other side. Remember the Browning 32 cal shooting the sofa, then a tire on the truck, then chasing the delivery man around the truck, firing three times at him. Would you also inform the folks what great things Bob Fish has done for the City ? I can't remember anything except negatives.

Oh my goodness, I'd almost forgotten about the couch-shooting story.................oh, what a riot..............thanks for the Friday laugh!

Yup, Folsom sure has a lot of its colorful history still to be remembered. I sure hope someone has documented it...........

[Bob]

QUOTE (FolsomFats @ Apr 29 2004, 06:24 PM)

Would you also inform the folks what great things Bob Fish has done for the City ? I can't remember anything except negatives.

Mr. FolsomFats,

It is a pleasure to reply. Following is a brief resume of my 15 years in Folsom:

I first moved to this area in 1977 and have been a Folsom resident for 15 years. In that time I have:

· Worked numerous hours with the City, community groups, and even developers to improve this City.

· Been active in the Lexington Hills Community Organization (LHCO), Director of the Environment. (1993 to 1998)

· Worked with others in LHCO to obtain over 12 acres of park sites within our community, which accounts for every square foot of park we now have. Lexington was a new subdivision of 1,400 homes left with out one square foot of park after a City “error” allowed developers to build houses on the original 32 acre park site. This was accomplished after the City turned their backs on us saying they were unable to obtain ANY parkland for us. (1993)

· Successfully negotiated with the Corp of Engineers to swap wetlands buffer and unrestricted acreage to form a usable park site for a ball field. This occurred after the City first failed to determine this was a problem before paying the owner of the land an extremely inflated price, then had their own negotiation attempts with the Corp repeatedly rejected. (1994)

· Organized groups to plant over 200,000 plugs of native grass and hundreds of trees, in our wetland buffers, all of which were donated. (1994)

· Assisted the City of Folsom in the writing or review of the Hillside Development, Wetlands, and Open Space Ordinances. (1994)

· Acted as a Director of Folsom Kids Play, a group that organized over 2,000 resident volunteers to hand build a 20,000+sf wooden play structure, a centerpiece in the Folsom park system. The estimated cost to professionally construct this type of structure was over $450,000. We did it with donations of materials to labor and of food to childcare for the volunteer workers. (1995)

Several of the Directors from that effort are also involved in this initiative.

· Organized residents in my area and at my company to participate in Trail Days, an annual event to build trails throughout the city. (1995 to present)

· Participated in many Creek Week events to clear our local creeks.

· Written a TEA grant application for a class-1 bike trail along a scenic wetlands area that divided a large neighborhood, which placed 1st out of about 30 applications in our metropolitan area, bringing $220,000 to the City of Folsom. Those trails are now in providing a safe route for children to the local elementary school as well as recreation. (1996)

· Been a founding member of the Alliance of Folsom Residents. (1999)

· Been a member of the City Ad Hoc Committee on rezoning for affordable housing. (2002)

· Worked with others to lobby City Councils to bring improvements to many new developments within the City (Never once to try and stop or even reduce density, only to ensure parks, open space, trails, etc. all conformed to the General Plan, Ordinances, etc.) (1991 to present)

· Been Science Fair coordinator for St. Johns Notre Dame School (2002/2003)

· Been Coach for over a dozen youth sports teams in the City. Will again be coaching both my 12 year old and 6 year old daughters soccer teams. (1994 to present)

· Assisted with Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts for my son (not a full fledged adult leader, I can only aspire to follow in such dedicated peoples footsteps). (1995 to present)

· Acted as Structural Engineer of record for (designed) the Lake Natoma Crossing.

· Brought an opportunity (this initiative) to the families of Folsom that will allow them to control the future of their City.

I put so much effort into community service and providing information to Folsom residents for many reasons. I have the professional training to understand government documents, where to look for them, and what to look for (particularly those dealing with our infrastructure). But mostly, I do it because I care. I have three young children and see the world through eyes that will lead to their future.

Regards,
Bob Fish
Folsom Residents for Sensible Growth
www.FolsomGrowth.org

[longgone]

Thank you Bob Fish for all you have done, and are doing!

Folsom is lucky to have you!