75 replies to this topic

[Bill Z]

Thank you Andrea V I think we are on the same page. I also would not have my kid in daycare all day, and dont think its WRONG for people to do but it saddens/sickens me that a child would be left with a stranger for 12 hours...

What do you mean with a stranger? If you talk with the teachers and staff, they become non-strangers. and they definitely aren't strangers to the kids.

[prouddad]

What do you mean with a stranger? If you talk with the teachers and staff, they become non-strangers. and they definitely aren't strangers to the kids.

Compared to a parent. But I seem to be offending people and I dont want to do that So I respectfully will end my conversation. To anyone I may have offended, my apologies....it was just my opinoin

[itsADEZI]

I was trying to add my own input here, a topic near and dear. After the 5th paragragh I chose to spare you all of the ramblings, as important as I feel they might be, I pulled out a few items to share.

~Young children are resilient and by Gods grace generally "happy" with what they are given (they only know what they know). That said, I do not believe that just because a child might not "complain" about a situation that it is necessarily the BEsT for them.

~What is the most ideal environment or situation for the child?
Answer that for yourself, keeping in mind, that it does not always line up with what is the most convenient situation for the parent.

~Some parents feel more comfortable with the larger institutions, as if they might be better regulated or that because of numbers or popularity they are better. I would be VERY careful with that thinking.

~I am often at early childhood education workshops and I am constantly being reminded that for the early years (ages 2-5) that play, imagination, play, sensory, and more play, is key to brain development. It is sometimes hard to have such a free environment at a large center with a 1:12 ratio. (I can't help but think of a herd of cows here)


~In the past 20 years I have worked in small, large, and corp. preschool/daycare. I have yet to and will never send any of my own children to a large preschool daycare. I also know many, very many, teachers that feel the same way. Please do not get me wrong, there are large centers that "feel" small. They usually have a more "homey" environment along with 1:4/1:6 ratio and those are certaintly exceptions.

~If anyone were to inform me about my childs school, even with poor grammar, I would hope that I would take it into DEEP consideration before disregarding. I would feel compelled to move beyond pride, comfort or convenience and find out, observe, or dig a little deeper into the accusations before relying on the "my child seems happy" theory.

and my not so last thought for now.....

~ at the risk of sounding hypocritical, I also believe that unless there is something abusive occurring at school/care, they will turn out fine Their HOME LIFE will always be a greater influence (as long as they are home more hours than at school)

[Bill Z]

~If anyone were to inform me about my childs school, even with poor grammar, I would hope that I would take it into DEEP consideration before disregarding. I would feel compelled to move beyond pride, comfort or convenience and find out, observe, or dig a little deeper into the accusations before relying on the "my child seems happy" theory.

Well then how about "my child is excelling academically, shows no signs of abusive behavior, and if I don't watch it, from what I hear, by the end of next year, he will be better at Powerpoint presentations than I am"? theory.

No, I'm not going to take DEEP consideration from some 2-bit flamer on here when I have 6+ years of experience with the Phoenix School. He claimed the parents don't care about their kids, well I know the parents that I've seen for the last 6+ years, and they do care very much about their children. I see them at school, I see them at Birthday parties (which is where I get the chance to talk with them at length), I see them on Field Trips, I see them and hear their questions at "back to school" night. To say the parents don't care is pure hogwash.

[itsADEZI]

Well then how about "my child is excelling academically, shows no signs of abusive behavior, and if I don't watch it, from what I hear, by the end of next year, he will be better at Powerpoint presentations than I am"? theory.

No, I'm not going to take DEEP consideration from some 2-bit flamer on here when I have 6+ years of experience with the Phoenix School. He claimed the parents don't care about their kids, well I know the parents that I've seen for the last 6+ years, and they do care very much about their children. I see them at school, I see them at Birthday parties (which is where I get the chance to talk with them at length), I see them on Field Trips, I see them and hear their questions at "back to school" night. To say the parents don't care is pure hogwash.

I am very happy that you have had such a wonderful experience. I am sure the school is an adequate fit for alot families and I agree, to lump all parents together, saying that they do not care is hogwash.
As someone in the field, I was more concerned with the accusations towards the program lacking imaginative play and not tolerating tears.
The gist of my post was bigger. It was more about programs in general; ratio's, philosophy's and ideal environments.

......my child is excelling academically, shows no signs of abusive behavior, and if I don't watch it, from what I hear, by the end of next year, he will be better at Powerpoint presentations than I am"


I was wondering how old your child is, the one that is excelling academically
If your child is under the age of 5 then that would be the reason for my .
I am very sensitive to this. When I opened up my preschool I thought I needed to "sell" the program to the parents. I had worksheets and "jobs" and told them how we would approach teaching sounds and letters, science, geography...blah blah blah. It is now the end of our first year and the program has completely morphed and evolved for the better. I have followed the lead of the children and of course followed up on the most up to date training and workshops. The children squish, dance, cut, glue, garden, problem solve, and have ample opportunity to learn self regulation. They are not sent home with a lot of "work" but with constant observations (which is possible with a 1:4 ratio) we always see growth. The 5 year olds are not only ready for Kindergarten by the set standards they are also content and have had a gazillion hands on experiences. I am constantly being pulled back to the fact that PLAY based programs will prepare a childs BRAIN so that they can better succeed later on in life. So as you can see, it is a topic very close to my heart and daily life.




I assume you are joking about the powerpoint, but it still makes me a little uneasy considering that there are PREschools that push...and push...and in return get pat on back ($$$) from the parents as they boast of their three year olds achievments. By third grade most of those kids are on serious "burnout", which I find sad.
I do not know you and am not saying that is you. I am merely pointing out that it happens like that.

I also would like to point out here that there are schools that are big or small and still cater to the children and not to what "sells" based on Folsom's academic trends.

[Bill Z]

I am very happy that you have had such a wonderful experience. I am sure the school is an adequate fit for alot families and I agree, to lump all parents together, saying that they do not care is hogwash.
As someone in the field, I was more concerned with the accusations towards the program lacking imaginative play and not tolerating tears.
The gist of my post was bigger. It was more about programs in general; ratio's, philosophy's and ideal environments.

......my child is excelling academically, shows no signs of abusive behavior, and if I don't watch it, from what I hear, by the end of next year, he will be better at Powerpoint presentations than I am"


I was wondering how old your child is, the one that is excelling academically
If your child is under the age of 5 then that would be the reason for my .
I am very sensitive to this.

My son is 7 and will be in 2nd grade next year where they start teaching powerpoint in the computer class. My son went to the Broadstone campus for daycare until Kindergarten when he moved over to the Elementary School.

I wouldn't say Phoenix stifles imaginary play, they might try to re-direct when too much play is based on firing weapons. And when a kid is hurt or something, they don't just tell the kid to suck it up, they comfort the children when they get owies (i've witnessed it), but if the kid cries too long, I agree with the "it's time to dry up those tears and go wash your face" directions.

[bordercolliefan]

It's very hard to generalize -- which is what is so lame about prouddad/james 1's posts.

It SOUNDS good for a kid to have the 1:1 dedicated 100% attention of a stay-at-home parent: what could be more loving?! And, in many cases, it is good.

But my daughter had a kid in her kindergarten class who apparently had gotten a bit TOO much individualized, parental attention. This kid expected to have his own personal adult attending to him all the time. When he failed to abide by the kindergarten policies, his mom explained to us that at home, he was accustomed to her sitting down and reasoning out/negotiating what the rules would be. Bottom line: he grew up thinking that the world -- and adults -- revolved around him. That kid would undoubtedly have been better off if he was put in child care at an early age and learned he was just one of a group.

Bottom line is, there are good and bad situations, both with a SAHP and in child care. It's up to each parent to be sensitive to their child and make sure the child is thriving.

[sat]

It's very hard to generalize -- which is what is so lame about prouddad/james 1's posts.

It SOUNDS good for a kid to have the 1:1 dedicated 100% attention of a stay-at-home parent: what could be more loving?! And, in many cases, it is good.

But my daughter had a kid in her kindergarten class who apparently had gotten a bit TOO much individualized, parental attention. This kid expected to have his own personal adult attending to him all the time. When he failed to abide by the kindergarten policies, his mom explained to us that at home, he was accustomed to her sitting down and reasoning out/negotiating what the rules would be. Bottom line: he grew up thinking that the world -- and adults -- revolved around him. That kid would undoubtedly have been better off if he was put in child care at an early age and learned he was just one of a group.

Bottom line is, there are good and bad situations, both with a SAHP and in child care. It's up to each parent to be sensitive to their child and make sure the child is thriving.

I absolutely agree. Having been both a working and stay-at-home parent, I can attest to the pros and cons of each. Even when I stayed home, I still had my kids in a preschool for two or three days a week, three hours at a time, for socialization and to help prepare for kindergarten. They needed the break from me, and I definitely enjoyed those few precious hours of solitude.

I'm interested to know if the parents who have posted against daycare also do not like the idea of sending their child to preschool for a few hours a week.

[supermom]

Well, I didn't post against day care.

But I did post that I feel strongly for small home care environments.

My kids have had experiences in all forms of childcare, except an Au Pair.

They have had several nannies, home daycare (licensed and unlicensed), small daycare, military daycare/preschool, preschool/daycare headstart, corporate daycare (childrens world), and even franchised daycare.

Then I have also had unlicensed childcare providers, providers who did not speak English as a first language.

My kids are doing fine socially, educational wise, etc.

The real truth is that the parents need to find childcare for their child that their child can adapt to. The parent needs to be aware of what the childs personality, intellect and emotions can handle.

If you have a really shy kid (my kids are totally the opposite of shy) then many of the options I chose while literally travelling all over the world--probably would not have worked for you.

Absolutely, I won't say that your choices are wrong (unless you are intentionally putting your child in harm)---but some kids are very malleable and adaptable to different types of environments and some just cannot accept any change whatsoever to an established routine in their lives.

[mylo]

You're all very bad parents

[supermom]

You're all very bad parents

Your Right!!!!


I need to hurry up and get home.

It's my turn to make dinner, check the homework, wash the dishes, feed the pets, scare the kids into telling me how their day was (while threatening to take away their DS)---and ...ohh...so many more projects.

[palango]

If someone did aan exhaustive study of myfolsom.com posts (excluding politics), daycare/childcare would rank as #1 or #2 with emotional responses , outburts, "you are a bad parent", "how dare you leave your kid with a stranger", etc.

No parent is perfect. I used to "jump the gun" and criticize some parental styles vs another, but now that I have my own struggles on a daily basis, I am getting a dose of reality. What I cannot stand is the folks who criticize and are NOT parents themselves. Unless you walk in our shoes 42X7, you have very little value to add (IMHO). Unless you are a worl renowed child psychologist researcher emplyed at the UC Davis MIIND institute and have the streed cred to back it up.

[sat]

If someone did aan exhaustive study of myfolsom.com posts (excluding politics), daycare/childcare would rank as #1 or #2 with emotional responses , outburts, "you are a bad parent", "how dare you leave your kid with a stranger", etc.

No parent is perfect. I used to "jump the gun" and criticize some parental styles vs another, but now that I have my own struggles on a daily basis, I am getting a dose of reality. What I cannot stand is the folks who criticize and are NOT parents themselves. Unless you walk in our shoes 42X7, you have very little value to add (IMHO). Unless you are a worl renowed child psychologist researcher emplyed at the UC Davis MIIND institute and have the streed cred to back it up.

When I was in my 20's, my sisters both had little kids. I was huge on giving advice, and questioning their decisions with child rearing. Then, when I turned 30 and had my first child, and then in the next three years, two more, I realized I was only the "perfect parent" when I had no children. Coming from someone who used to say that you do not need to be a parent to comment or judge other people's parenting styles, I was humbled with the birth of my own kids. Like Palango said, it is 24x7, and sometimes you do not make the best decisions. I do feel that I am fairly good parent, but not nearly the perfect parent I imagined I would be and told everyone I would be before I had my kids.

[Chad Vander Veen]

When I was in my 20's, my sisters both had little kids. I was huge on giving advice, and questioning their decisions with child rearing. Then, when I turned 30 and had my first child, and then in the next three years, two more, I realized I was only the "perfect parent" when I had no children. Coming from someone who used to say that you do not need to be a parent to comment or judge other people's parenting styles, I was humbled with the birth of my own kids. Like Palango said, it is 24x7, and sometimes you do not make the best decisions. I do feel that I am fairly good parent, but not nearly the perfect parent I imagined I would be and told everyone I would be before I had my kids.

Wow, that sounds exactly like me.

[Bill Z]

I don't recall ever being a "back seat parent" aka giving parenting advice before I was a parent. But I do know the one thing I thought about parents before I had a kid, I still truly believe in.

If you are in a restaurant, movie theater, etc, and little johnny is having a melt down, it's time for you to pack up your stuff and leave. The rest of the patrons deserve to enjoy what they paid for in peace. My son is pretty good in restaurants, we've only had to walk out & leave twice (asking for our food to be boxed up to go and leaving a nice tip) and one time I had to take my son out for a heart to heart talk about his behavior before returning inside the restaurant.

But I do agree with the ole adage, no matter what you think about how your life will change when you have kids, you will still be surprised by some of those changes. It is one thing you just can't understand until it's happened to you.