129 replies to this topic

[Darth Lefty]

I do wish the Wine Gallery had more sculpture and some softer lighting.

[ducky]

Another loss of business on Sutter St. Grapes & Ivy is closing June 29.  The owner is retiring and closing the business.

 

There was also a very good letter to the editor about the number of establishments with liquor licenses on Sutter St. and how it is reaching a tipping point and its effect on nearby residents and, indeed, all of us because of all the young people getting into cars that shouldn't.  It's not about, "This used to be a bar and now a new bar has opened in its place and so what's the problem?"  That's a short-term view of what Sutter St. used to be.  I enjoy some of those places and have even danced at the establishments talked about here (there are definitely occupancy limit issues on certain nights), but there needs to be a balance.  

[Steve Heard]

Another loss of business on Sutter St. Grapes & Ivy is closing June 29.  The owner is retiring and closing the business.

 

There was also a very good letter to the editor about the number of establishments with liquor licenses on Sutter St. and how it is reaching a tipping point and its effect on nearby residents and, indeed, all of us because of all the young people getting into cars that shouldn't.  It's not about, "This used to be a bar and now a new bar has opened in its place and so what's the problem?"  That's a short-term view of what Sutter St. used to be.  I enjoy some of those places and have even danced at the establishments talked about here (there are definitely occupancy limit issues on certain nights), but there needs to be a balance.  

 

I am all for balance and new businesses. Many businesses have tried but failed on Sutter. There's a reason that the car dealership, gas station, bank, general store and pharmacy aren't there any more, and it's not because there are too many drunks at night. 

 

By the way, there are no NEW 100% liquor establishments that I can think of. All of the new bars are actually restaurants. Fat Rabbit, Same Horne's, Sutter Street Steak House, Hampton's, they're all restaurants. Even Lockdown has a deli counter. 

 

My wife and I shop and spend our money on Sutter Street, and it's not just at bars. We've bought clothing, jewelry, art work, food, candles, home decor items, and with the new farmer's market, great fresh produce. 

 

Sure, I've seen a few drunk folks out there, even had a run-in with one who apparently disagreed with my wife and I being of different races, but I've never felt threatened or felt I was in any danger, and I've never seen any drunks during normal business hours. 

 

Cities and neighborhoods change, and we'd all like to hold on to what we have, but that's not the way the world generally works. The market decides which businesses succeed and fail.

 

If more Folsomites shopped on Sutter perhaps some of those businesses would survive, and the could stop blaming business owners who sell products that they don't consume. 

 

My friends and clients from out of town who visit Sutter remark how beautiful it is, how fun it is, and love the fact that the historic buildings are in such great shape (from the outide anyway), yet so many locals complain about it. 

[4thgenFolsomite]

 

I am all for balance and new businesses. Many businesses have tried but failed on Sutter. There's a reason that the car dealership, gas station, bank, general store and pharmacy aren't there any more, and it's not because there are too many drunks at night. 

 

By the way, there are no NEW 100% liquor establishments that I can think of. All of the new bars are actually restaurants. Fat Rabbit, Same Horne's, Sutter Street Steak House, Hampton's, they're all restaurants. Even Lockdown has a deli counter. 

 

My wife and I shop and spend our money on Sutter Street, and it's not just at bars. We've bought clothing, jewelry, art work, food, candles, home decor items, and with the new farmer's market, great fresh produce. 

 

Sure, I've seen a few drunk folks out there, even had a run-in with one who apparently disagreed with my wife and I being of different races, but I've never felt threatened or felt I was in any danger, and I've never seen any drunks during normal business hours. 

 

Cities and neighborhoods change, and we'd all like to hold on to what we have, but that's not the way the world generally works. The market decides which businesses succeed and fail.

 

If more Folsomites shopped on Sutter perhaps some of those businesses would survive, and the could stop blaming business owners who sell products that they don't consume. 

 

My friends and clients from out of town who visit Sutter remark how beautiful it is, how fun it is, and love the fact that the historic buildings are in such great shape (from the outide anyway), yet so many locals complain about it. 

I love Sutter Street too, Steve.  I think its the gradual loss of daytime businesses that is the worrisome aspect of this for some of us.  All of the new establishments you mention have later hours, not earlier.  I am very happy, though, that the pubs and Hamptons serve weekday lunches.  That is a great boost to the street.  There are plenty of other daytime businesses that would do well there, without having to throw back al the way to Main Street kind of businesses like you mentioned above.  Vintage or retro anything would be great, including candy like 5 & 10 that just opened in Palladio.  Kitchenwares, also good.  And how about a really good Folsom tourist store with lots of touristy gift items?

[Steve Heard]

I love Sutter Street too, Steve.  I think its the gradual loss of daytime businesses that is the worrisome aspect of this for some of us.  All of the new establishments you mention have later hours, not earlier.  I am very happy, though, that the pubs and Hamptons serve weekday lunches.  That is a great boost to the street.  There are plenty of other daytime businesses that would do well there, without having to throw back al the way to Main Street kind of businesses like you mentioned above.  Vintage or retro anything would be great, including candy like 5 & 10 that just opened in Palladio.  Kitchenwares, also good.  And how about a really good Folsom tourist store with lots of touristy gift items?

 

The later hours of the bars is exactly what I'm talking about. They are not driving businesses out because they do most of their business in the evenings after the daytime businesses are closed.

 

One one here called Sutter Street a 'near cesspool', and I strongly disagree. It is a beautiful jewel.

 

The kind of stores you're talking about may in fact do well, particularly one with Folsom-themed items. I just hope someone steps up and makes them happen. I'd sure support them. 

[4thgenFolsomite]

 

The later hours of the bars is exactly what I'm talking about. They are not driving businesses out because they do most of their business in the evenings after the daytime businesses are closed.

 

One one here called Sutter Street a 'near cesspool', and I strongly disagree. It is a beautiful jewel.

 

The kind of stores you're talking about may in fact do well, particularly one with Folsom-themed items. I just hope someone steps up and makes them happen. I'd sure support them. 

 

well, sort of agree, sort of disagree with that first statement.  when a daytime business closes and another nighttime business goes in, there is one less daytime place to visit on the street.  the more the merrier when it comes to taking out of town guests to walk through and visit the shops.  same thing for people who want to shop.  they want more choices, not fewer.  and when night time revelers leave their trash and bodily fluids on the street, daytime business owners get more and more disgusted and think about moving to other cleaner places.

 

as for your second statement, I wholeheartedly agree.  Sutter Street is clean and well maintained, thanks to the hard efforts of store owners and the merchants' association that spends a lot of money keeping it that way.

 

on the third, yeah, let's do it, Steve!  I have friends in Portland that just opened an arts and crafts cooperative called Artistic Portland.  Really unique and affordable, since its a coop.

[Steve Heard]

 

well, sort of agree, sort of disagree with that first statement.  when a daytime business closes and another nighttime business goes in, there is one less daytime place to visit on the street.  the more the merrier when it comes to taking out of town guests to walk through and visit the shops.  same thing for people who want to shop.  they want more choices, not fewer.  and when night time revelers leave their trash and bodily fluids on the street, daytime business owners get more and more disgusted and think about moving to other cleaner places.

 

as for your second statement, I wholeheartedly agree.  Sutter Street is clean and well maintained, thanks to the hard efforts of store owners and the merchants' association that spends a lot of money keeping it that way.

 

on the third, yeah, let's do it, Steve!  I have friends in Portland that just opened an arts and crafts cooperative called Artistic Portland.  Really unique and affordable, since its a coop.

 

I think it's clear that you and I both have great affection for the Historic District. 

 

I see a lot of potential, and love the new look for the most part. Lot of folks would liked it better the old way and would have liked to have left it the way it was.

 

Folks who've lived here for generations long for the days when it was the center of town, and I can appreciate that.

 

The question is, are daytime businesses really being driven out and replaced by bars? If we're talking about recent (past 10 years) Sam Horne's, Lockdown and Fat Rabbit all replaced old restaurants and bars. 

 

Ms. Teaz was replaced by a home theater company, American Visions old location was replaced by a Real Estate company. The portrait studio was replaced by Grapes n Ivy, and I think the portrait studio now occupies the building where Sutter St. Steak is. 

Grebitus was replaced by a physical therapy office (and has relocated to Palladio). 

 

I just don't see all the bars choking out thriving day time businesses. 

 

I don't think I want to see Sutter become Bourbon St or Rush St, but I don't think that's happening, with at least 3 new day time businesses opened or opening soon, and I'm betting more will come in. 

 

As for the tourist shop, somebody front the money, I'll help with the concept, we'll hire staff and get rich! 

[ducky]

 

I am all for balance and new businesses. Many businesses have tried but failed on Sutter. There's a reason that the car dealership, gas station, bank, general store and pharmacy aren't there any more, and it's not because there are too many drunks at night. 

 

By the way, there are no NEW 100% liquor establishments that I can think of. All of the new bars are actually restaurants. Fat Rabbit, Same Horne's, Sutter Street Steak House, Hampton's, they're all restaurants. Even Lockdown has a deli counter. 

 

My wife and I shop and spend our money on Sutter Street, and it's not just at bars. We've bought clothing, jewelry, art work, food, candles, home decor items, and with the new farmer's market, great fresh produce. 

 

Sure, I've seen a few drunk folks out there, even had a run-in with one who apparently disagreed with my wife and I being of different races, but I've never felt threatened or felt I was in any danger, and I've never seen any drunks during normal business hours. 

 

Cities and neighborhoods change, and we'd all like to hold on to what we have, but that's not the way the world generally works. The market decides which businesses succeed and fail.

 

If more Folsomites shopped on Sutter perhaps some of those businesses would survive, and the could stop blaming business owners who sell products that they don't consume. 

 

My friends and clients from out of town who visit Sutter remark how beautiful it is, how fun it is, and love the fact that the historic buildings are in such great shape (from the outide anyway), yet so many locals complain about it. 

 

I still visit Sutter St. and still try to support the remaining businesses that I like, especially for gifts.  Even though there are aspects of the renovation I really don't like (railings, the omitted fountain feature - I really think that was a mistake), I don't avoid the area and certainly have visited the many restaurants and even the bars and enjoy the special family nights.  

 

I just agree with the writer that there is a tipping point, and also sympathize with the residents of the historic district over the noise and unpleasant leavings they find in their yards.  Even if the new establishments aren't 100 percent bars that only serve liquor, the proximity of the establishments lends itself to bar hopping.

 

I love CW's and 4thgen's ideas for a 5 & 10 and the unique hardware store, but, I agree with you that if the market won't support that, especially if you get more traffic out closer to the freeway, then you end up with what it will support.

 

I don't really consider myself a local because I didn't grow up here, and I know things can't stay the same forever and shouldn't (like your run-in with the butthead), but, yeah, it is hard to see unique things you liked about the town go away and watch it start looking like everywhere else.  I miss Peppermint Patties, the zoo being free, easier parking access to the lake and river area that were free, the decorated vehicles with the baseball teams parading around town.

 

The most treasured thing I find about Folsom is the safety.  I've always tried to walk for errands as much as humanly possible.  I love our trails.  I was amazed when we moved here that you could walk around town without being harassed and loved it.   Never had a problem with anyone bothering me until last week.   I'm hoping it's not going to become a more frequent thing.

 

"Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you got till it's gone..."

[ducky]

The city council voted to approve the $750,000 Lake Natoma Waterfront and Trail Access Enhancement Project 4-1.

[Darth Lefty]

Oh?  Of what does that consist?

[ducky]

Oh?  Of what does that consist?

 

You can find more info on the city site.  There was an article in The Folsom Telegraph.  There's a little bit of controversy and concern environmentally about the project.

 

There's also this for more info:  www.usbr.gov/mp/nepa/documentShow.cfm?Doc_ID=9695.

[chris v]

That looks awful.  Wish they would leave it alone.

 

 

 

You can find more info on the city site.  There was an article in The Folsom Telegraph.  There's a little bit of controversy and concern environmentally about the project.

 

There's also this for more info:  www.usbr.gov/mp/nepa/documentShow.cfm?Doc_ID=9695.

[The Average Joe]

Basically, ANOTHER expensive ADA compliance move. When is enough enough? I suppose when Half Dome has it's ADA compliant ramp we'll be done...

[Darth Lefty]

I don't object to it, although I sort of wish they'd spread the money further along the trail rather than concentrating it in a dead end loop.  The canoe launch is a nice idea, although I'm not seeing where they have added parking for it, or how to carry it down all those stairs.

 

I and my FBIL took my old Grumman out on Lake Natoma last weekend.  We paddled up to the sign and waved at the guards, then got chased by a herd of hungry geese.  It was fun.

[4thgenFolsomite]

I don't object to it, although I sort of wish they'd spread the money further along the trail rather than concentrating it in a dead end loop.  The canoe launch is a nice idea, although I'm not seeing where they have added parking for it, or how to carry it down all those stairs.

 

I and my FBIL took my old Grumman out on Lake Natoma last weekend.  We paddled up to the sign and waved at the guards, then got chased by a herd of hungry geese.  It was fun.

they are putting in an ADA ramp, so that would be a way to roll a canoe down.  although.....the state park does provide that directly across Lake Natoma already and with its own dedicated parking lot.