158 replies to this topic

[Chad Vander Veen]

Did you know 30 cities in the U.S. are planning to build (or have already started building) a streetcar or trolley system, including Sacramento? Folsom already has the rail! Wouldn't this be a great way to alleviate traffic in town, draw tourists and celebrate our deep railroad roots?

[cw68]

Did you know 30 cities in the U.S. are planning to build (or have already started building) a streetcar or trolley system, including Sacramento? Folsom already has the rail! Wouldn't this be a great way to alleviate traffic in town, draw tourists and celebrate our deep railroad roots?

I'd love it!

[4thgenFolsomite]

I would absolutely love it too.  However, I keep seeing the current council dismiss it as impossible or impractical.  Anyone know why?  the tracks are already there.  I think it would be fantastic.  is it the cost of the crossing signals?  or that residents would complain?  if it were already in place, I think people would use it heavily.  I would.

[ducky]

It would link the hotels by 50 & Iron Point to Sutter St., too.  It is definitely an idea that shouldn't be dismissed.

[supermom]

I would use it. Especially if it linked the historic to the malls/post office/ parks.

 

A lot of the kids would use it, too.

[mrdavex]

Definitely yes!  I would also like to see an excursion train to Placerville, with packages including bus tours of Apple Hill or the wineries.  

 

Obviously, it will cost money in rehabbing the tracks to sustain higher speeds and installation of crossing signals, purchase of cars, and constructing stations.  However, we have a cost advantage since the railway easement already exists.  The most costly part of building a rail system from scratch is acquiring land and all the associated legal obstacles, eminent domain, environmental impact studies, etc.  We already have a bike trail paralleling most of the tracks, so we would also garner national recognition for Rails with Trails.  

[supermom]

I second the Apple Hill thing.

 

I would love to get on a train and ride up there!!

[tony]

I would absolutely love it too.  However, I keep seeing the current council dismiss it as impossible or impractical.  Anyone know why?  the tracks are already there.  I think it would be fantastic.  is it the cost of the crossing signals?  or that residents would complain?  if it were already in place, I think people would use it heavily.  I would.

Not positive, but I think you hit on the key issues with a streetcar in Folsom. I'm pretty sure the cost of the crossings and the fear of complaints about traffic, along with lack of density to support ridership are the major hurdles (developing S of 50 won't help that cause any). A typical traffic signal costs about $250,000. I'm not sure about rail crossings, but they are probably in that ballpark. The route shown would require at least 11 controlled crossings, so that's about $3M before you do any rail improvements, buy rolling stock or do engineering and environmental work. A quick internet search shows streetcar costs range from about $15M/track mile to $40 M/track mile. Chad's route is about 4 miles, so, assuming we would be at the low end of the range, that's at least $60M. Now one way to improve the financial picture is to use self-propelled cars like the Regio Sprinter that then Mayor Holderness brought out for a demonstration back in the 1990s (the NCTD Sprinter Rail in San Diego County uses these). Incidentally, whether you think it was a good idea or not, that was a brilliant political move that convinced RT to bring Light Rail to Folsom at least 20 years before they were planning on it.  Anyway, because of the relatively low density development along the route (not many people living within 1/2 mile radius of stations), I suspect ridership projections would be low.  Now, if coupled with the revitalization of the E. Bidwell corridor to include higher density development in the vicinity of the stations, then it might start to pencil out.  But then, as soon as anyone suggests allowing higher density development in town, every gets up in arms and says no. But you can't have good transit and good cool urban places without higher density, at least in the vicinity of the transit stations. 

[tessieca]

How about getting an in-city travel rate for the light rail?  I would love to take it to and from historic Folsom, but the cost of going 2-3 stops is not worth it.

[Chad Vander Veen]

How about getting an in-city travel rate for the light rail?  I would love to take it to and from historic Folsom, but the cost of going 2-3 stops is not worth it.

 

That's a great idea! I'm all for improvements to light rail, which has a number of issues that could be solved to make it more profitable/useful. The biggest issue, of course, is that it is a proof-of-payment system (i.e. the honor system of buying tickets). That wouldn't be so bad if RT police could walk the trains from one end to the other but they can't so it's doubly hard to enforce.

[Stop South of 50]

Serious question.  Looking at the route of the street car, it looks to be easily covered by a bus route, why would we be more advantageous to spend a lot more $$$ on initial startup and operating costs when a bus could do the same exact thing?  I feel there are a lot more pressing needs in the city than to make this a prominent issue.  Completing city parks that are currently "proposed park sites", more police/fire to meet the growing needs of our city, etc.

[TruthSeeker]

Yes!

[Barb J]

It would be a great attraction to use this proposed railway for special events as well!  At night during Halloween it could turn into a haunted ride, at Christmas you could ride with Santa...etc.  That would be a great money maker for the City and the surrounding businesses!

 

You have my vote Chad!  I am praying you and Roger can get in there and shake things up!

 

Barb J

[Steve Heard]

Serious question.  Looking at the route of the street car, it looks to be easily covered by a bus route, why would we be more advantageous to spend a lot more $$$ on initial startup and operating costs when a bus could do the same exact thing?  I feel there are a lot more pressing needs in the city than to make this a prominent issue.  Completing city parks that are currently "proposed park sites", more police/fire to meet the growing needs of our city, etc.

 

After seeimg Tony's estimate of $60 million, I'm inclined to agree. Perhaps some alternative fuel busses running from Palladio to the Historic District might be considerably cheaper and less have less impact on infrastructure.  

[ducky]

 

After seeimg Tony's estimate of $60 million, I'm inclined to agree. Perhaps some alternative fuel busses running from Palladio to the Historic District might be considerably cheaper and less have less impact on infrastructure.  

That is a scary number, but there is something about a train as far as tourism goes.  The East Bidwell Street Corridor Project is at least considering the option of using the rails along East Bidwell (Next open house is November 13, I believe, at the library).  As long as it is something that is reliable and runs at regular intervals, it will be used.  I'd love to ditch the car more than I do now, especially with the mileage tax in the works.  Everybody was so good about buying hybrids and electric vehicles that get better gas mileage that the giant gas taxes we pay aren't enough anymore.  The government needs more, more, more.  I envision fewer and fewer people being able to afford a car.  Being able to hop on a trolley, train, people mover, whatever, to get to the bank, doctor appointments, light rail station, would be a good thing.  And they are thinking of more mixed-use going in along the way like near Oak Avenue Parkway.