199 replies to this topic

[webuser]

Well, it is not as if this is the very first Lifestyle Center, nor is it going to be the one located in the most severe climate, so it is a tested concept. The developers have their money on the line and if they thought they would make more money on a traditional indoors mall, they would have built one.
Because of the economy, any type of additional retail center may fail now regardless to being indoors or outdoors. They will need to postpone opening until people are willing to shop enough to support dozens of new stores in the area.

[4thgenFolsomite]

my guess is that the majority of people out shopping during the day are women. women don't want to go on a hike in the heat or rain or dark, so an indoor mall is a great place if you need to go to a couple of stores or just look around at different stores. Like resume lady said, my experience is that at an indoor mall, you look around at numerous stores. at an outdoor mall, you hit the one you're interested and then get back in your car. the way Fountains and the Broadstore (Borders) malls are arranged, you almost have to get back in your car to go to more than one store.

[webuser]

my guess is that the majority of people out shopping during the day are women. women don't want to go on a hike in the heat or rain or dark, so an indoor mall is a great place if you need to go to a couple of stores or just look around at different stores. Like resume lady said, my experience is that at an indoor mall, you look around at numerous stores. at an outdoor mall, you hit the one you're interested and then get back in your car. the way Fountains and the Broadstore (Borders) malls are arranged, you almost have to get back in your car to go to more than one store.

So the mall developers do not know that women shop at stores or did not check the history of other existing Lifestyle Centers before deciding to build this one?
Borders is in a strip mall with a gigantic parking lot that spreads the stores out over a great distance. The Lifestyle Centers have stores close together.

[knittychick]

I know part of the draw for outdoor malls is security. In Milwaukee, WI a nice indoor mall, Northridge, was literally taken over by gangs and eventually had to be completely shut down. This was a large mall with all the usual anchor stores - Sears, J.C. Penny, etc. after it was shut down the gangs moved to another more upscale mall - Mayfair - which has waged a war and enforced curfews, etc. to battle them. I have read that other indoor malls have had the same problem - gangs turn them into their "headquarters." I know parking lot security can be a concern in outdoor malls, but that's more random, not organized gangs.

[Darth Lefty]

The hottest summer day at the peak of a heatwave is less than the average summer day in Phoenix that people there walk around in without a thought.

As a former resident of said city, I have to tell you that on an average summer day, people hurry from one air-conditioned environment to the next and stay outside as little as possible. The city (and most other large desert cities) are only made bearable by the invention of air conditioning. Otherwise they would still be the frontier outposts and mining ghost towns and truck stops they deserve to be. Can you imagine Vegas without AC?

This is all paid off by the weather in the winter, which is fantastic.

[Terry]

Drove by Palladio almost every day this week (including today) and saw a lot of work going on.

[jagayman]

As a former resident of said city, I have to tell you that on an average summer day, people hurry from one air-conditioned environment to the next and stay outside as little as possible. The city (and most other large desert cities) are only made bearable by the invention of air conditioning. Otherwise they would still be the frontier outposts and mining ghost towns and truck stops they deserve to be. Can you imagine Vegas without AC?

This is all paid off by the weather in the winter, which is fantastic.

Something Lefty and I have in common. But don't you miss that feeling of walking outside and having all the skin on your face dry out and tighten up like a drum head? Ahhh... refreshing.

Actually, I only lived there for two summers. My boss couldn't argue with me wanting to move to Folsom so I could have grass on my front yard.

[M.E.G.]

I have to say I am one of those who is looking forward to the Palladio. I love living here in Folsom and the heat in the summer. We came from Cupertino and I hated that summers felt like fall there. I am hoping the the Palladio will have plenty of restaurants with outside dining. While I like going to the indoor malls, I have gone to the Fountains twice and think it is nice, but needs more stores. Someone mentioned that you have to get back into your car to go to other stores at the Fountains. I disagree. It is a very small area to walk.

I grew up in Bloomington Indiana, and like most of the towns in the midwest, the town had the courthouse in the middle and the area around it called the "square" Those were shops, restaurants, dry cleaners etc, and that was were all the shopping was. Holidays with Santa Claus, rallys, etc were always there. You usually ran into to someone you knew. I have only once ran into someone I knew at the Gallaria and that was just last week! I guess I like the community feel of it.

M.E.G.
Professional Shopper, not Buyer

[4thgenFolsomite]

I have to say I am one of those who is looking forward to the Palladio. I love living here in Folsom and the heat in the summer. We came from Cupertino and I hated that summers felt like fall there. I am hoping the the Palladio will have plenty of restaurants with outside dining. While I like going to the indoor malls, I have gone to the Fountains twice and think it is nice, but needs more stores. Someone mentioned that you have to get back into your car to go to other stores at the Fountains. I disagree. It is a very small area to walk.

I grew up in Bloomington Indiana, and like most of the towns in the midwest, the town had the courthouse in the middle and the area around it called the "square" Those were shops, restaurants, dry cleaners etc, and that was were all the shopping was. Holidays with Santa Claus, rallys, etc were always there. You usually ran into to someone you knew. I have only once ran into someone I knew at the Gallaria and that was just last week! I guess I like the community feel of it.

M.E.G.
Professional Shopper, not Buyer

I think you make an excellent point here. When I was back east, all these little towns had a classic townsquare that predated suburban sprawl. people drove in from their farms, etc., to do their town stuff, go to the bank, shop, visit the doctor. like mayberry rfd. its european as well, the piazza, the plaza, etc. It's where people also go in the evening to socialize. It's also what Sutter Street used to be in Folsom (post office, court, hardware store, grocery, clothing store, doctor, lawyer, fire department, restaurants, etc.)

I'm sure its the community feeling these outdoor malls are trying to provoke. I just haven't seen one in sacramento that has succeeded. and I again point ot the success of Sunrise Mall and the failure of Birdcage Walk. I hope Palladio is a huge success when it opens because that will be good for all of us. I just know that Fountains is not my favorite place to shop, it just felt like a cold, dark hike getting from one end to the other when I was trying to shop at christmas, while the galleria was warm, bright, and dry going from Nordstroms to Macys.

[webuser]

Why would Birdcage Walk be successful when it doesn't have the mix of stores people want to shop at? If they enclosed it with those same stores, that wouldn't help it.
Few people can name stores at Birdcage Walk other than Target, Lowes and Best Buy.
Birdcage Walk is still very strip-mallish with a big parking lot and it is a little awkward to get around. It is not comparable to the way Palladio is planned at all.
Fountains is better than Birdcage, but it really doesn't have many stores that I care about.
People are making bad comparisons between Palladio and strip malls just because both are not enclosed.

Palladio may fail because they waited way too long to get started. Many of the stores that would have come here 10 years ago are at the Galleria now and don't want another location within 20 miles. On top of that, the meltdown in the economy is making others think of pulling out or postponing.

[stacycam]

The downtown plaza is an outdoor mall. I haven't been there in a while, but it seems to be doing fine. I know I shopped there many times in the rain and heat. OTOH, I don't do the same at the outlets. I just hit the stores I want and go. I think maybe it depends on the mix of stores, as webuser said. Also the feel and energy makes a difference.

I am completely disappointed that the mall is not coming. I was so looking forward to somewhere in Folsom to spend my money. I suppose I should be happy, because I'm sure my wardrobe would be much larger (and my checking acct much smaller) if we had a decent clothing store here.

[ducky]

The downtown plaza is an outdoor mall. I haven't been there in a while, but it seems to be doing fine. I know I shopped there many times in the rain and heat. OTOH, I don't do the same at the outlets. I just hit the stores I want and go. I think maybe it depends on the mix of stores, as webuser said. Also the feel and energy makes a difference.

I am completely disappointed that the mall is not coming. I was so looking forward to somewhere in Folsom to spend my money. I suppose I should be happy, because I'm sure my wardrobe would be much larger (and my checking acct much smaller) if we had a decent clothing store here.

I've been to Downtown Plaza when it's raining and hot, too. It just seems more sheltered than the outlet mall here in town. The heat doesn't bother me so much, but I'd drive over to Roseville Galleria or Sunrise Mall before I'd go to the outlet mall if it's pouring rain. I don't know why they didn't at least put more awning-type coverage at the center on East Bidwell with Michael's and Sports Authority. It's a pain in the butt if you need to go from one end to the other. I know it's actually discouraged me from wandering around the shops in bad weather. I'll just hit one store and leave.

[Chris]

One thing I can't stand about the Folsom outlets (other than it was designed and layed out by an idiot) is that people hang out and smoke everywhere. I don't like cigarette smoke and I go out of my way to avoid it. Thus, I rarely go to the outlets, maybe twice a year. Being that the new Palladio is outdoor I guess I won't be shopping there very much either. Some of the worst offenders are the employees of the stores themselves who walk 10 feet from the store door and light up. One thing I like about the Roseville Galleria is that once I get in a door I don't have to deal with those dam cigarettes....! Chris

[a little bean]

I am completely disappointed that the mall is not coming. I was so looking forward to somewhere in Folsom to spend my money. I suppose I should be happy, because I'm sure my wardrobe would be much larger (and my checking acct much smaller) if we had a decent clothing store here.

This is still all completely heresay people, and already you're disapointed that the mall's not coming! Have some optimism. Drove by this morning and there's still ton's of construction going on. Seems to me that if it was done, there wouldn't be a parking lot full of construction worker's cars parked out front. Haven't heard a peep about it from Elliott yet, so I'm still going to assume that it's happening until I'm told otherwise from the source. I can't wait for the mall to open. If even half of the retailers that were on the original list are still on board, I think it will be great! There are a lot of really high end retailers that don't have much of a presence anywhere else, and I can't wait. Anything that allows me to keep my tax dollars in Folsom seems like a good thing to me.

[4thgenFolsomite]

This is still all completely heresay people, and already you're disapointed that the mall's not coming! Have some optimism. Drove by this morning and there's still ton's of construction going on. Seems to me that if it was done, there wouldn't be a parking lot full of construction worker's cars parked out front. Haven't heard a peep about it from Elliott yet, so I'm still going to assume that it's happening until I'm told otherwise from the source. I can't wait for the mall to open. If even half of the retailers that were on the original list are still on board, I think it will be great! There are a lot of really high end retailers that don't have much of a presence anywhere else, and I can't wait. Anything that allows me to keep my tax dollars in Folsom seems like a good thing to me.

great optimism. I hope you are right. the more $$ for city coffers, the better! in fact, if you need to buy a car, buy it in Folsom!

and are you sure the construction work is on the retail and not the Kaiser out-patient surgery center?