190 replies to this topic

[Farley]

Sacramento's risk of flooding, in short, is the greatest of any major American city, according to SAFCA

http://www.sacbee.co...-14338923c.html

And for a long time there has been talk of a one hundred years flood. In other words, Sacramento could flood in any given year, but likely once in every 100 years.

[tessieca]

My sister signed up with Catholic Community Services of Baton Rouge to take in a refugee family for a couple of months. She lives in Arizona, but also volunteered to go and pick them up. I tried to call and offer the same thing, but all circuits are busy, and you can get through just now.

If anyone else has an extra room in their home, you might try to contact them at (225) 336-8770.

I've also tried calling our local Sacramento Catholic Charities organization and am awaiting a call back. 733-0253. Maybe they can coordinate with local organizations to make some of these placements. It's got to be a far better solution for someone than hanging out in an Astrodome or school for several months.

[CostcoLover]

Sacramento's risk of flooding, in short, is the greatest of any major American city, according to SAFCA

http://www.sacbee.co...-14338923c.html

How long is that article? Can you paste some of it here? I really would rather not register with Sac Bee and for some reason bugmenot is not working for me.

Are there maps? Do they show the potential flood area zones? Do they discuss what the potential threat would come from, etc. ? Any statistical data in the article?

[Terry]

It would be really interesting to hear from all these people as to what they were thinking when they decided to defy the "mandatory" evacuation.
It was so obvious the hurricane was severe.  The only hope was that it might change course and shift east or west a little and not hit at full force, but why risk it?

I know some people couldn't leave for logistical reasons, but if those were the only people who stayed, the problems would have been a fraction what they are now.
I bet 90% of the people who stayed really could have left.

I agree. And I'm going to get into some deep doodoo by what I'm going to say next. Given the demographics of NO in general, I would suspect that those who chose to stay were relying on the government to give them whatever help they needed whether they chose to leave or chose to stay. These are the same people who are demanding things now and will for some time to come. And these people have probably been living on government programs for their whole lives and possibly generations of lives. In a nutshell, they have their welfare worker programmed on their speed dial. They can't, don't, and won't help themselves by getting out, and now want us (the government) to fix all that ails them.

And don't start down that "race" road. I said nothing about race here, I'm talking demographics of NO.

[nhardy]

I agree.  And I'm going to get into some deep doodoo by what I'm going to say next.  Given the demographics of NO in general, I would suspect that those who chose to stay were relying on the government to give them whatever help they needed whether they chose to leave or chose to stay.  These are the same people who are demanding things now and will for some time to come.  And these people have probably been living on government programs for their whole lives and possibly generations of lives.  In a nutshell, they have their welfare worker programmed on their speed dial.  They can't, don't, and won't help themselves by getting out, and now want us (the government) to fix all that ails them.

And don't start down that "race" road.  I said nothing about race here, I'm talking demographics of NO.

If you're right, death was the ultimate price to pay for a free handout. I'm sure the tens of thousands that flocked to the SuperDome and Conv Center didn't get together and plan a way to screw the system.

Show some compassion.....

[brown]

I agree.  And I'm going to get into some deep doodoo by what I'm going to say next.  Given the demographics of NO in general, I would suspect that those who chose to stay were relying on the government to give them whatever help they needed whether they chose to leave or chose to stay.  These are the same people who are demanding things now and will for some time to come.  And these people have probably been living on government programs for their whole lives and possibly generations of lives.  In a nutshell, they have their welfare worker programmed on their speed dial.  They can't, don't, and won't help themselves by getting out, and now want us (the government) to fix all that ails them.

And don't start down that "race" road.  I said nothing about race here, I'm talking demographics of NO.

I don't know if this is true or not, but I heard that 100,000 adults in NO do not have cars and relied upon public transit to get around. Perhaps it was very difficult for them to leave logistially? I'm sure there were buses and trains heading out of town, but I can imagine it's a lot easier to pack up the car and bail than it is to take PT.

[randb]

How long is that article?  Can you paste some of it here?  I really would rather not register with Sac Bee and for some reason bugmenot is not working for me.

Are there maps?  Do they show the potential flood area zones?  Do they discuss what the potential threat would come from, etc. ?  Any statistical data in the article?

Hurricane Katrina seems far removed from Sacramento, but levee failures in New Orleans, one day after the storm, are a chilling reminder that the two cities have a lot in common.
At least two levees protecting historic New Orleans failed Tuesday morning, weakened by Katrina's storm surge. The city flooded up to 20 feet deep in places, submerging the fabled French Quarter, forcing evacuation of hospitals, and creating a nightmare of water contamination and broken utilities.

The consequences, in economic and human terms, are impossible to measure.

But one fact bears mentioning: New Orleans had better flood protection than Sacramento, and still it was overwhelmed.

"Clearly this is a wake-up call," said Sacramento Mayor Heather Fargo, "not only to get flood insurance, but to continue to work hard to strengthen our levees and improve flood control."

Levees are the first line of flood defense for both New Orleans and Sacramento, which are similar in population.

Unlike Sacramento, New Orleans lies next to the ocean and below sea level. And California doesn't get hurricanes.

There are times, however, when much of Sacramento lies below the level of the American and Sacramento rivers at flood stage, straining our vital levees. And, as in New Orleans, rushing water can have a fatal scouring effect on Sacramento levees.

"In a lot of ways, we see New Orleans as a sister city," said Stein Buer, executive director of the Sacramento Area Flood Control Agency. "We feel deeply the tragedy that's unfolding."

New Orleans was said to enjoy 250-year flood protection, meaning the city faced a 1-in-250 chance of flooding in any given year. Central Sacramento, in comparison, is rated to withstand only a 100-year flood event.

Sacramento's risk of flooding, in short, is the greatest of any major American city, according to SAFCA.

"One of these days, we might get a huge storm," said Rep. Doris Matsui, D-Sacramento. "We have to take steps to ensure something like this doesn't happen to a community like Sacramento."

Sacramento narrowly dodged that bullet in two recent wet years, 1986 and 1997. As a result, local officials developed an ambitious plan, originally estimated to cost about $700 million, to improve flood protection to a one-in-213 standard.

The project includes modifications to Folsom Dam and many miles of levee improvements along the Sacramento and American rivers.

Much of the project remains unfunded, and recent setbacks have slowed progress.

Bids for a key project to improve Folsom Dam's release capacity came in up to three times higher than the $215 million estimate. As a result, it could now be up to three more years before full construction begins.

[CostcoLover]

Thanks, I was hoping to see the potentially affected areas, maps, statistics, etc. what exactly is considered, "central Sacramento"?

[Terry]

If you're right, death was the ultimate price to pay for a free handout. I'm sure the tens of thousands that flocked to the SuperDome and Conv Center didn't get together and plan a way to screw the system.

Show some compassion.....

No way was I saying they were planning to screw the system. Simply that some people are so dependent upon others/the government that they can't even help themselves.

I have compassion, just don't understand people who don't seem to have sense to save themselves. Look at a map of the area. If they would have left when the first evacuation was declared, they could have WALKED TO SAFETY!

[CostcoLover]

Terry,

Much of this has to do with expectations and information flows. If on day 1 they knew that evacuation would come 4 days later... I suppose many (that could) would have started walking out.

These people don't have a means of communicating right now. They don't know the extent of the damage - for all they know they'd have to walk hundreds of miles to find relief.

[Terry]

Terry,

Much of this has to do with expectations and information flows.  If on day 1 they knew that evacuation would come 4 days later...  I suppose many (that could) would have started walking out. 

These people don't have a means of communicating right now.  They don't know the extent of the damage - for all they know they'd have to walk hundreds of miles to find relief.

I'm talking about the evacuation order that was made before the hurricane it. They could have started walking at that point.

[Steve Heard]

I agree.  And I'm going to get into some deep doodoo by what I'm going to say next.  Given the demographics of NO in general, I would suspect that those who chose to stay were relying on the government to give them whatever help they needed whether they chose to leave or chose to stay.  These are the same people who are demanding things now and will for some time to come.  And these people have probably been living on government programs for their whole lives and possibly generations of lives.  In a nutshell, they have their welfare worker programmed on their speed dial.  They can't, don't, and won't help themselves by getting out, and now want us (the government) to fix all that ails them.

And don't start down that "race" road.  I said nothing about race here, I'm talking demographics of NO.

Terry

In some communities you probably would be in deep doodoo, but I'm afraid there may be many in our community who feel the same way you do.

The fact is that Louisiana enacted welfare reform, as well they should have, in 1995. They instituted a plan by which one could only stay on welfare for 2 years. By 1997, they had reduced welfare rolls by 46%, 14th highest drop of the 50 states.

The problem is that many of those who fell off the welfare rolls are still alive, and broke. Some are dependent on charitable organizations, under the table jobs, and government 'make work' programs. Many are just working poor. With lots of free time, no money, and no hope, thousands of kids are coming up hustling and robbing to make a living. It is shameful and said.

Some of those people stayed behind.

Some were too poor to flee, some were too frail, some too defiant, some too stupid, some thinking the National WEather Service was crying wolf, as they do every year, in some peoples' minds.

I doubt if many of them thought, "Let's stay and lose everything. Some of us will die, but the rest of us will some day get government assistance. Yayhee!"

You do bring up a valid point, however, and that is that our welfare system has taken hope and initiative away from people. The south is still the south, and although the government has quotas in hiring, many private businesses are still as segregated as they were 40 years ago. To be poor and black in New ORleans usually means that you will stay that way. Many never get out.

Generations grow up getting and expecting government assistance in housing, food, and medical care. The trick is, how to wean them off. You see what happened in New ORleans when the needed basics of food, water and shelter were cut off by nature. Cutting it off by the government won't be much better.

No excuses for violence, stealing TV's, and shooting at helicopters, but some compassion is in order for people who's only crime is poverty.

This tragedy is shining a light on New Orleans, and our country. Some are reacting with their best, and some aren't.

No one wants to be left behind.

[camay2327]

Check out the following web site.

http://www.katrina.com/


This young lady has turned down $500,000 to sell her personal web site and has turned it into a site to help out the Hurricane Katrina people.

This lady is to be commended.

What a great person.

[CostcoLover]

I'm talking about the evacuation order that was made before the hurricane it.  They could have started walking at that point.

It's not advisable to be walking outside when a hurricane is about to hit. If you're caught outside during a hurricane, it's highly probable you'll get killed or injured by flying debris.

[Deb aka Resume Lady]

My sister signed up with Catholic Community Services of Baton Rouge to take in a refugee family for a couple of months.  She lives in Arizona, but also volunteered to go and pick them up.  I tried to call and offer the same thing, but all circuits are busy, and you can get through just now.

If anyone else has an extra room in their home, you might try to contact them at (225) 336-8770.

I've also tried calling our local Sacramento Catholic Charities organization and am awaiting a call back.  733-0253.  Maybe they can coordinate with local organizations to make some of these placements.  It's got to be a far better solution for someone than hanging out in an Astrodome or school for several months.

I've signed up on a few lists to take in a family, but haven't heard anything yet. I've also e-mailed several of the churches and other organizations that have been set up as shelters; again, haven't heard anything yet. I've e-mailed all of the major network stations, the Louisiana Governor... asking how the information is getting to victims...Hopefully, the only reason we haven't had our offer taken advantage of is because of the distance... Hopefully offers within a closer range of the disaster areas are being taken advantage of. Not sure if anyone wants to come to California, but if the choice is sitting in a shelter indefinitely, I'd think being in a home would be more attractive. I'm not sure HOW the information regarding home offers is getting to the victims. Do they have access to the Internet in these shelters? Do the volunteers in the shelters have time to sit on the Internet looking for homes for the victims? Even if you were willing to fly a family out, if they don't have driver's licenses or other ID on them, would the airlines let them fly? We've also donated cash to the Red Cross.

Steve, do you have any information as to how victims who fled are being connected with available homes? What are you hearing from your friends and family?