86 replies to this topic

[Carl G]

The NSE principal was out there this morning getting people to follow the traffic rules.  It was nice to see.

 

I don't know the percentage, but I'm guessing a lot of parents are dropping their children off while they are heading off to work.  It doesn't make sense to walk your children to school, back track, then head off to work.  Depending on where you work, you may not be able to get to work before 9AM.

[supermom]

Lol, you two heard about the parent whom was referred to CPS by the police department for allowing their two children aged 6 and 10 to walk a block from their home to a park?

They were forced to sign an agreement with the police department that they would never allow their children to walk outside unsupervised ever again or they would be separated from their children and CPS would take them. The average time the children were at the park each time was 30 minutes to an hour including the walk there and back.

 

So from that extreme-you have parents who drive their kids to school and parks or just don't let them go anywhere.

 

Which one is overall healthier and safer for a child growing up in our society?

[supermom]

The NSE principal was out there this morning getting people to follow the traffic rules.  It was nice to see.

 

I don't know the percentage, but I'm guessing a lot of parents are dropping their children off while they are heading off to work.  It doesn't make sense to walk your children to school, back track, then head off to work.  Depending on where you work, you may not be able to get to work before 9AM.

I dont see how or why that function would fall on the responsibilities of a school principal. It should be local law enforcement. 

And I strongly feel that smaller school populations would limit vehicle interactions in parking lots. Furthermore, the whole loop d loop in the school parking lots is an absolute nightmare. I wonder how many accidents have been in that parking lot? people are trying to park in parking spaces to wait or get out and go see admin or a game and then you have ridiculous lines of vehicles and students jetting into the parking lot. Then you have the whole crowd of kids that hang out by the back of the auditorium and occasionally throw stuff at passing cars or suddenly sit down and stick their legs out into traffic.....

 

There is entirely too much vehicle contact near students. It should be limited to a straight in-out for pick ups. and the other parking lot used for parking. All students should be told to get into pick up lines or get off the school grounds using sidewalks. 

 

Lessen the chaos!

[Dave Burrell]

Lol, you two heard about the parent whom was referred to CPS by the police department for allowing their two children aged 6 and 10 to walk a block from their home to a park?

They were forced to sign an agreement with the police department that they would never allow their children to walk outside unsupervised ever again or they would be separated from their children and CPS would take them. The average time the children were at the park each time was 30 minutes to an hour including the walk there and back.

 

So from that extreme-you have parents who drive their kids to school and parks or just don't let them go anywhere.

 

Which one is overall healthier and safer for a child growing up in our society?

 

What the .. !? Seriously? That's too way much gov't for ya!  This nanny state nonsense needs to stop.

 

To add to my story about walking/riding to school since 1st grade,  at my schools we had cross walk attendants on every major street corner to help kids safely cross and stop the insane parents from running stop lights and stop signs.

 

Why do not all schools still have cross walk attendants? Is it because school admins don't see the importance of child safety getting to and from schools?

[tony]

As my kids are too young for school at this point I am wondering why so few kids are walking? Growing up, we walked to school every day for elementary and then after that walked to the bus stop about 1/2 mile away...

 

•  Is it distance?
• Pedestrian Safety?
• Concerns related to criminals/pedophiles??
• Helicopter Parents?
• Timing/ability to parents to drop off?

It seems to me the act of dropping off kids creates a bit of chaos around the schools for a period of time in both morning and afternoons. I wonder what impact the dropoff zones (or lack thereof) has on the overall safety around our schools?

 

I guess the question is, if the City/school district did a better job and  invested in the engineering side (roadway design, sidewalk/crossing design) would you let your kids walk to school?

It is all of those things. CW already talked about school siting, which leaves too many kids too far to walk.

 

Two-worker households is another, although you'd think that would lead to more latch-key kids.

 

Fear of abduction, etc.  But this one has been soundly debunked, as there is no more risk of stranger abduction now than there was when I was going to school in the 60s and 70s.

 

But the biggest reason is probably just priorities. Not enough parents recognize the many benefits of walking or riding to school, and many schools actively discourage it by doing things like requiring permission slips to walk or ride to school.  The good news is that schools around the country are doing something about it. CW mentioned Safe Routes to Schools programs,. Well, those got started in northern CA not too far from here (Napa), and are starting to show results. According to the National Center for SR2S, walking and biking to school (in the morning) increased from 12.4% of students to 15,7% of students between 2007 and 2012 (afternoon numbers are 3 to 4% higher).  Unfortunately, their survey also showed that only 33% of schools actually encourage walking and biking to school, but that, too, was up.

 

So, why should kids walk or bike to school?

• Exercise built into their daily schedule - a great way to fight the obesity epidemic
• It's fun!
• They learn their way around their neighborhood (most kids who get driven everywhere have very little sense of direction).
• They learn basic traffic skills (those who learn to bike properly will be way ahead of their peers when it comes time to learn to drive a car).
• It's fun - for parents and kids (younger kids need chaperons)!
• They learn independence.
• They learn that, unlike the wicked witch of the west, they will not melt in the rain
• It's fun!
• Kids who bike or walk to school are much more likely to bike or walk other places
• They very quick improve their biking skills if they bike every day.
• It's fun!
• According to a recent Danish Study, walking or biking to school had a larger positive impact on concentration at school than even a good breakfast or lunch. According to the lead researcher:  "The results showed that having breakfast and lunch has an impact, but not very much compared to having exercised," Egelund told AFP. As a third-grade pupil, if you exercise and bike to school, your ability to concentrate increases to the equivalent of someone half a year further in their studies".  Or, as CW would say, "it gets the willies out!"
• Did I mention it's fun?
• The more kids walk and bike to school, the safer it is for all of them (safety in numbers)
• More kids walking and biking means less crazy parents driving around schools.
• It's fun!

And, for anyone who has not heard my rants on this before, yes, my four boys have been biking to school (and even running the 1.8 miles one way on occasion) since they were old enough to be strapped into a car seat and through elementary school (oldest is in high school 24 miles away, so no biking there...yet, although he has taken light rail). Our seventh grader is comfortable going just about anyplace in Folsom on his bike by himself (nine miles round trip to Kemp Park for soccer practice; no problem).

 

As for the City and FCUSD, the only way they will start being supportive of biking and walking is if parents start making a priority.   And, BTW, even though my kids go to Catholic schools (which present whole other challenges in getting kids to walk and bike because they serve even larger geographic areas), I have worked with everal public schools in Folsom and Rancho through the 50 Corridor TMA, including Natoma Station with CW, trying to help get SR2S programs going, or helping organize bike to school and bike safety training events. Kids love them, and parents do too.

[tony]

Lol, you two heard about the parent whom was referred to CPS by the police department for allowing their two children aged 6 and 10 to walk a block from their home to a park?

They were forced to sign an agreement with the police department that they would never allow their children to walk outside unsupervised ever again or they would be separated from their children and CPS would take them. The average time the children were at the park each time was 30 minutes to an hour including the walk there and back.

 

So from that extreme-you have parents who drive their kids to school and parks or just don't let them go anywhere.

 

Which one is overall healthier and safer for a child growing up in our society?

Happy to agree with you completely on this one!

[redman]

I can't speak for all the schools but I can tell you about my experience at Russell Ranch as I've had a child there for the past eight years. Every year at Back to School Night the principal explains the traffic pattern and drop off/pick up procedure, and implores parents to slow down. We have parents paid to monitor the different areas in the morning and afternoon. They open car doors for students, direct traffic, etc. The weekly newsletter often reminds parents to slow down. We have a new principal this year and she ordered some large signs with flags and cones with messages such as "slow" and "bus lane only". A few times a year a motorcycle cop does sit out there and I've seen him issue tickets. A few years ago I contacted the city's traffic department about the need for another crosswalk. Mark Rackovan met me and the principal at the school to observe the morning commute and the crosswalk was painted within the week.

Even with all of the above, parents still drive way too fast. They pull over in random spots and let their kids out to cross in front of traffic with no cross walk in sight.

The best solution I've found is one that was mentioned above. We get to school by 8:10 when the traffic is very light. I tell my kids all the time to assume that the cars don't see them and that they won't stop.

 

This is what I'd like to see at NS: recognition that some planning, signage, communication, and enforcement would help tons, and then stay consistent with it. I was glad to see this morning that Mr. Bosque the School Principal was out there monitoring things, and a motorcycle officer was stationed at the intersection. That's a start. But what we really need is a plan, that accounts for peak traffic flow, and is communicated to parents and reinforced. 

 

As my kids are too young for school at this point I am wondering why so few kids are walking? Growing up, we walked to school every day for elementary and then after that walked to the bus stop about 1/2 mile away...

 

•  Is it distance?
• Pedestrian Safety?
• Concerns related to criminals/pedophiles??
• Helicopter Parents?
• Timing/ability to parents to drop off?

It seems to me the act of dropping off kids creates a bit of chaos around the schools for a period of time in both morning and afternoons. I wonder what impact the dropoff zones (or lack thereof) has on the overall safety around our schools?

 

I guess the question is, if the City/school district did a better job and  invested in the engineering side (roadway design, sidewalk/crossing design) would you let your kids walk to school?

 

It's all those things, and societal pressure to keep much closer tabs on our kids. I feel like it's too much, and we need to loosen the leash a little, but I also fully expect to be judged if I do that. 

[cw68]

There’s a multitude of reasons why kids don’t walk to school as much as they used to. Some are solid reasons, others based on fear and speculation.

 

·          Is it distance?

This is a factor. Nationally, this is the number one barrier to walking/biking to school.. As I mentioned earlier, schools are necessarily placed in central locations. Russell Ranch is a perfect example of that. In 1969, 41% of students between kindergarten and 8^th grade lived within one mile of school, and 88% of these children walked to biked to school. In the 70s, that all started to change and many districts began building schools on the edge of communities where land costs are lower (Folsom isn’t unique in this respect.) in 2009 only 31% of students lived within one mile of school and only 35% walked or biked.

·         Pedestrian Safety?

When I have asked other parents why their kids don’t walk to school, this reason probably came up more than any other. Nationally, it’s the second biggest barrier. It’s a catch 22, because by not walking (or letting the kids walk) and driving, they are adding to the vehicular traffic. (Up to 25% of morning rush hour traffic is parents driving their students to school.) However, pedestrian safety is a huge and valid concern. The drivers are crazy and, at NSE, there is rarely any crossing guard. When there is, it’s only at one intersection, when three intersections really need one.

·         Concerns related to criminals/pedophiles??

Yes. Nationally, this is the fourth biggest barrier. However, the dangers is much lower than parents think, especially because Folsom doesn’t exactly have a gang problem, which does affect safety when walking to school in some communities. Believe it or not, unless your family has custodial issues, kids are safer walking to school than we were in the 70s. Yes, really. In 2002 (I can’t find a more current study) only 2% of reported missing children were the result of non-family abductions.

·         Helicopter Parents?

Parents today are control freaks. It’s usually done for good reason and concern for their children’s well-being, but it’s also increasingly inappropriately intrusive and managing. Parents going on job interviews for their adult children? Negotiating job offers? Calling the university president when there are roommate issues in the dorm? Yes, these all happen. What we parents should strive for is being a safety net and not our kid’s constant training wheels – help, not coddle. We can’t, nor shouldn’t keep our children from experiencing pain or trouble in their lives. Studies have shown that college students with helicopter parents have a hard time believing in their own ability to accomplish goals. They were more dependent on others, had poor coping skills and weren’t as responsible or conscientious in school. It’s really a no-brainer that we parents need to let go more.

·         Timing/ability to parents to drop off?

I definitely think this is a factor. More working parents, less time with their kids and often leaving about the same time. I can see wanting to spend an extra five minutes with them and dropping them off on the way.

 

 

I think there is another factor here at play, especially as the kids get older, and that’s the weight of the backpacks. My kids literally have sore backs when they have to walk distances with their backpacks. They weigh a ton, even without schoolbooks in them. I wish for lightweight Kevlar binders since it seems that every teacher requires them. But, this is a whole other modern problem we’re created for our kids…

[Steve Heard]

 

Steve, I'm glad you had pleasant experiences in terms of traffic safety at the schools, but I haven't.

 

There are plenty of individual success stories to be found, but to be effective in making a marked impact, it has to be a district- or city-wide priority.

 

While I'm not denying there's a problem, I believe that my experiences were more typical of what most people incurred. The schools that I dealt with seemed very safety conscious, with both staff and volunteers on hand, and I do recall school communications regarding drop-off rules, and how they reconfigured the parking lot at Folsom Middle to make it safer.

 

So, I don't think the problem is that the schools don't take safety seriously. That's all. Can they do better? Perhaps. The real problem is the people in the cars.  Try going to court and telling a judge 'It's not my fault I hit that kid. The school doesn't do enough.'

 

I encourage you and other parents to continue your efforts.

[cw68]

As for crossing guards…

 

When I was in elementary school, fifth graders were the crossing guards. It was an honor to be chosen as a crossing guard. But, schools won’t let kids be crossing guards anymore, so that narrows the possible pool a lot.

 

NSE worked on volunteers for crossing guards, but there simply aren’t enough volunteers. Jobs interfere; once I went back to work, there was no way I could do it. Others can’t because (ironically) they have to get their kids off to multiple schools. Some don’t want to be yelled at by drivers.

 

Paying crossing guards would help with recruiting, but the district doesn’t have the money. When our three-year grant got money to pay for crossing guards, the district wouldn’t allow a funded position with a limited monetary source. GRRRR. I’m still bothered by that and it was years ago.

 

I don’t know what the solution is here.

[supermom]

The district wouldnt allow? Well, fuzzy foo foo, just send them out there anyway. Whats the worse that can happen? 

People see things get better and demand the guards stay in place?

[cw68]

The district wouldnt allow? Well, fuzzy foo foo, just send them out there anyway. Whats the worse that can happen? 
People see things get better and demand the guards stay in place?

They wouldn't allow it to be a paid position. We couldn't pay them out of our pockets, it had to come from the grant.

[supermom]

CW- I luv ya hon---but that should have been advertised in public spaces, journalism and social media sites!!!

 

After yesterday--perhaps even more so...

 

Unionism vs child safety is absolutely unacceptable.

[cw68]

CW- I luv ya hon---but that should have been advertised in public spaces, journalism and social media sites!!!

 

After yesterday--perhaps even more so...

 

Unionism vs child safety is absolutely unacceptable.

 

 

Social media wasn't as prevalent when the grant was implemented. We did what we could do; it's obvious that it wasn't enough, but it is what it is.

[Carl G]

I dont see how or why that function would fall on the responsibilities of a school principal. It should be local law enforcement. 

And I strongly feel that smaller school populations would limit vehicle interactions in parking lots. Furthermore, the whole loop d loop in the school parking lots is an absolute nightmare. I wonder how many accidents have been in that parking lot? people are trying to park in parking spaces to wait or get out and go see admin or a game and then you have ridiculous lines of vehicles and students jetting into the parking lot. Then you have the whole crowd of kids that hang out by the back of the auditorium and occasionally throw stuff at passing cars or suddenly sit down and stick their legs out into traffic.....

 

There is entirely too much vehicle contact near students. It should be limited to a straight in-out for pick ups. and the other parking lot used for parking. All students should be told to get into pick up lines or get off the school grounds using sidewalks. 

 

Lessen the chaos!

 

I don't disagree with you regarding enforcement being done best by Folsom's Finest, however, I don't think we have enough police to have one stationed at each school.  That is why I would like to see them rotate through the schools for traffic enforcement purposes.  Given the limited availability of the police, I think the next best person to do the job is the principal.  I think a principal out among the parents and students is way better than one who sits in the office.

 

Regarding NSE specifically - I would like to see either the middle school bus depart 10 minutes earlier or have the bus pickup on Turn Pike.  The problem now is the bus takes up about half of the indented area where dropoffs are made.  Also, before the students load onto the bus, the line extends down the sidewalk further obstructing the flow of elementary students onto the campus.  No parking lot is used for drop off purposes.  If I'm not mistaken, someone puts cones in front of the driveway because they don't want parents driving into the teachers' only parking lot.

 

From what I've seen, too many parents want to drop their kids off and then sit there for several minutes.  Also, you'd be surprised how many parents park and leave their car there, maybe only for a minute of two, but it still mucks up the traffic flow.