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My Kid --- Or Theirs?


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#76 bookwom

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 05:13 PM

QUOTE(tigerlily6 @ Nov 13 2008, 04:33 PM) View Post
I don't want your daughter texting in my son's class and disrupting his education. My husband and I have high expectations for him. He knows he would be grounded if he was caught texting in class.
I can not believe your attitude about this. You're just too afraid to be mad at your daughter for disobeying the rules that you take your anger out on the school.
I want to ask you a question. Does your daughter plan to go to college? it sounds as if you put little value on a good education.



OH, goodness, gracious me. Did you even read my post, or any of my subsequent posts?

I never claimed it was not wrong for her to text in class. In fact, in my first post, I said it was bad, bad, bad. And I have never argued with the school's right to take it away from her. It is their right to lay down policies for the students during school hours. My disagreement was with them keeping the cell phone from me, as it is my property and my decision whether she uses it after school or not. As to how my husband and I chose to handle this situation, that is no one's business. I am not afraid to be mad at my daughter, as she would be able to tell you. And as both my husband and I have graduate degrees, I can assure you we put very high value on a good education.

I congratulate you on you high expectations son. I'm sure he must be a model of perfection, always knowing what is expected of him and never doing otherwise. How comforting it must be to know that your superior parenting abilities have produced such a paragon. It also must be comforting to be so omniscient that you can make sweeping value judgments on other parents based on a forum thread.
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#77 Darthvader

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 05:18 PM

QUOTE(bookwom @ Nov 13 2008, 05:13 PM) View Post
OH, goodness, gracious me. Did you even read my post, or any of my subsequent posts?

I never claimed it was not wrong for her to text in class. In fact, in my first post, I said it was bad, bad, bad. And I have never argued with the school's right to take it away from her. It is their right to lay down policies for the students during school hours. My disagreement was with them keeping the cell phone from me, as it is my property and my decision whether she uses it after school or not. As to how my husband and I chose to handle this situation, that is no one's business. I am not afraid to be mad at my daughter, as she would be able to tell you. And as both my husband and I have graduate degrees, I can assure you we put very high value on a good education.

I congratulate you on you high expectations son. I'm sure he must be a model of perfection, always knowing what is expected of him and never doing otherwise. How comforting it must be to know that your superior parenting abilities have produced such a paragon. It also must be comforting to be so omniscient that you can make sweeping value judgments on other parents based on a forum thread.


Don't you mean 2 threads? Weren't you looking for advice on a laptop to help occupy your kids time? You're an electronic parent, congrats!

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#78 ChipShot

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 07:21 PM

QUOTE(Darthvader @ Nov 13 2008, 05:18 PM) View Post
Don't you mean 2 threads? Weren't you looking for advice on a laptop to help occupy your kids time? You're an electronic parent, congrats!

I feel bad for bookwom.

Maybe they are overwhelmed...I don't know. I don't want to pass judgment. There might be other things there.

But cell phones in the classroom have to stop. Test scores are bad enough as it is.


I have opinions, you have opinions. We'll just call it even...is that OK ??

#79 s0479

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 07:29 PM

QUOTE(bookwom @ Nov 13 2008, 11:51 AM) View Post
Yeah, got it back, after having to listen to a lecture from the administrator. (My daughter wasn't there, I got the lecture)

Listen, I'm not arguing that it wasn't bad for her to be texting in class. Believe me, we have dealt with that. And if it happens again, she will be losing the ability to text and/or use that phone for anything but calling her parents for a very long time.

My complaint is that the school has no right to keep my property from me, as I am an adult, and they have no right to decide that my daughter cannot use that cell phone outside of school hours if I choose differently.


Oh I agree with you on this one. My daughter's phone went off last year in class...she forgot to turn it off (it was a wrong number) and they did the same thing tried to tell me again how long they'd keep the phone from us. While I was fine with them taking it from her at school, I let them know that the phone was my property not theirs. I told them try and keep it from me and if she gets hurt or something happens to her before or after school walking home and she had no way to contact anyone then they would be liable. Her phone was used for emergency purposes and for me to make sure she got to and from school safely. I got the phone back.

#80 s0479

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 07:42 PM

QUOTE(bookwom @ Nov 13 2008, 11:36 AM) View Post
OK, I'm am so tired of the attitude of some of our school teachers/administrators that seem to think that because my kids go to their schools, the kids are theirs and not mine. I won't name names, and I know it is not the attitude of all teachers/admin.

I first encountered this attitude a few years ago, when my husband and I decided to take our kids out of school for a week and do the independent study contract so we could have some special time as a family before my husband was deployed for a year. We actually got some resistance from my son's teacher. I wanted to say, but didn't, "Look, lady, this is my kid and I make the decisions. We're following state law and district procedure and it has nothing to do with you."

Now, I just had an unpleasant experience with my daughters administration. She was texting in class, which I agree is bad, bad, bad. The school policy is to take the phone away for 5 school days. Fair enough. I went in today to get the phone, and got grief because of the holiday, she's really not supposed to get it until after school today. First of all, that cell phone is my property, I'm an adult, and I never signed anything saying they could keep my property from me. They have no right to keep my property away from me. If I came in on the first day to claim it, I see no legal right they have to keep it away from me. They have every right to keep it from my daughter during school time, but no right to keep it from my daughter after school if I choose that she should have it. Again, I wanted to say, but didn't, "Listen, lady, you have every right to dictate what my daughter does or does not do at school, but after school, its just none of your business. Give me my damn phone and keep the lecture to yourself."

Phew, I feel better now.


I agree about the first part to. I've taken my daughter out of school a couple times for a few days over the last twelve years for what I feel are valid reasons (educational (there are things that are educational besides school) and family reasons) the teachers have a fit and make it heck for the kids when they get back. They act like our family has committed a crime and made it very difficult for her when she returned. (she's an A student so its not like she is struggling) She's my daughter and I will decide if there are other priorities out there.

#81 awood

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Posted 16 November 2008 - 04:43 PM

Whole lot of banter since the start...but trying to focus on the original topic:

1.) Yes it's your property, and I would make you come pick it up at school every time I had to take it from your daughter and hand it to you with a big smile each time "Nice to see you AGAIN...". (aka. I shouldn't see it during class time)

2.) Cell phones are becoming a fact of life that some view as a neccesity. Even in that scenario, texting is not. It takes 5 minutes total to call the cell phone company and block texting from your son or daughters phone. Regardless of how cheap and attractive the companies make the plans, I don't feel that my kid is best served communicating in code. We collectively (yes I discussed it with them before I blocked it) could not come up with a scenario that they NEEDED to text anyone. Unless you are communicating something that you shouldn't, there is no reason that good old fashioned talking wouldn't suffice.

3.) I saw that some were dead set on the fact that the folks running the schools were idiots. How dillusional you must be to not only send your kids to a place that you feel is staffed by idiots, but then believe that your kids are not at fault when they are caught misbehaving. If I thought for a moment that my parents would have believed me when I said my teachers were idiots, I would have won an Oscar for the performance I would have given portraying them as idiots. Worse then a parent that can't discipline their own kids is one that blames it on someone else.


#82 booboo

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 06:42 PM

I say all cells are off and tucked away between 7 - 3pm. Parents contact the school if they need to get a hold of the kids and vice versa.

#83 pet lover

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 09:03 PM

I didn't finish reading this post and I think it has gotten off topic, but I still want to respond.

I am a school teacher and think lower grade elementary students don't need cell phones, but there are probably reasons why parents may choose to provide their older children with one. I don't think it is the school's right to keep property that doesn't belong to them, but there should be some way they should be able to reinforce their rules with consequences when rules are broken. I'M SURE THAT SCHOOL PERSONNEL ARE GLAD THAT YOU CARE AND MONITOR YOUR CHILD'S BEHAVIOR because that isn't the case with all families.

In regards to the independent study comment, you're right it isn't our right to judge why a parents choose to keep their children from school (except for truancy or illegal or dangerous situations). Your reason for your children's absence is far better than some I have heard over the last fourteen years. While a week with dad won't replace the year he is gone, it is a good idea to celebrate the remaining time with him.

FYI - Schools don't get paid for students when they are absent. I don't remember what has changed in regards to the independent study.

We are all human and have our bad days but THERE ISN'T ANY EXCUSE FOR RUDENESS! Hopefully the teacher that was impolite will show good character and apologize.

#84 johncam

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 06:44 PM

QUOTE(booboo @ Nov 18 2008, 06:42 PM) View Post
I say all cells are off and tucked away between 7 - 3pm. Parents contact the school if they need to get a hold of the kids and vice versa.


Makes sense to me!

#85 joy

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Posted 03 December 2008 - 12:31 PM

QUOTE(bookwom @ Nov 13 2008, 12:36 PM) View Post
OK, I'm am so tired of the attitude of some of our school teachers/administrators that seem to think that because my kids go to their schools, the kids are theirs and not mine. I won't name names, and I know it is not the attitude of all teachers/admin.

I first encountered this attitude a few years ago, when my husband and I decided to take our kids out of school for a week and do the independent study contract so we could have some special time as a family before my husband was deployed for a year. We actually got some resistance from my son's teacher. I wanted to say, but didn't, "Look, lady, this is my kid and I make the decisions. We're following state law and district procedure and it has nothing to do with you."

Now, I just had an unpleasant experience with my daughters administration. She was texting in class, which I agree is bad, bad, bad. The school policy is to take the phone away for 5 school days. Fair enough. I went in today to get the phone, and got grief because of the holiday, she's really not supposed to get it until after school today. First of all, that cell phone is my property, I'm an adult, and I never signed anything saying they could keep my property from me. They have no right to keep my property away from me. If I came in on the first day to claim it, I see no legal right they have to keep it away from me. They have every right to keep it from my daughter during school time, but no right to keep it from my daughter after school if I choose that she should have it. Again, I wanted to say, but didn't, "Listen, lady, you have every right to dictate what my daughter does or does not do at school, but after school, its just none of your business. Give me my damn phone and keep the lecture to yourself."

Phew, I feel better now.


Sorry, I disagree with you on the second phone thing. I think the school does have the right to keep the phone in the school in all times until the term is up. You brought a personal device to the school and voilated the school rules, then they have the right to decide what to do with it, not just during school time. I think it serves a better lesson for the kids as well, not to be given the phone back to them after school. I don't agree that school needs a permission to be signed in order to do so. There is too much things that school are required to get permission first in order to implement something. Our system is way over-whelmed by this over-protection of our rights. If they are nice, they can let you have the phone back, as they did.


#86 mylo

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Posted 03 December 2008 - 12:42 PM

Hmm, the above post got me thinking.

What other "personal items" are against school rules. I'm not talking about guns or drugs or things that are illegal, but simply in violation of school policy.

If you wear an offensive shirt, they'll send you home with your property and tell you not to return with it.

What else is there? and what is the schools policy?

I'd like to think the school has a right to define what property is allowable on-campus, and has the right to take and properly dispose of violations of said rules. I just can't think of an example that backs that up...
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#87 Parizienne

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Posted 19 December 2008 - 11:42 PM

I used to get annoyed when parents took their kids out for weeks at a time on independent study. Not until I came to Folsom did I experience the volume of requests I see here at my current school. In my prior district, Independent Study contracts were very unusual and only for very extreme circumstances.

It doesn't bother me much now because I have grown accustomed to the half dozen requests I get for it every year. Why was I bothered? It's difficult to know exactly where we're going to be and how fast we're going to progress through certain material. So, I must guess at where I hope we'll be when the student leaves, how much we will cover while he or she is away, and where we'll be when the student returns.

My students do a major research project at a certain point in the year, and most of the work is done in class. Different kids progress through the process at different rates. Plus, I've had parents tell me that where they're going, they will not have access to computers and/or they don't really want to cart all of the student's textbooks along on their trip. I've also had students and parents complain that I have assigned too much work for a given independent study period. What they forget is that I am obligated to assign the same amount of work they would be doing if they were with the rest of the class in school. That IS a lot of work. I have an obligation to keep the student on pace with the class and grade level expectations.

It is due to these reasons that many teachers bristle at requests for independent study. Your reason for requesting it was valid, but perhaps the tension you sensed from the teacher was exasperation at the situation in general.

About the phone -- kids who text could be cheating. They could be gossiping. They could be photographing students and sending those photos to others who alter them on photoshop and post them to MYSpace or YouTube. The rule against texting is to protect the privacy and rights of the student population at large. I agree that your property should be returned if you request it. However, if it is an on-going problem, schools have to have some recourse because they must consider the safety and rights of all students who could be adversely affected by your child's misconduct. While your child's second offense followed an innocent mistake, many other students' first offenses aren't mistakes. They definitely abuse the rules and the patience and understanding of teachers, etc. It's a much bigger picture than people realize.


Pari.
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#88 FolsomResident2002

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Posted 20 December 2008 - 10:11 AM

Great responses!
QUOTE (Parizienne @ Dec 19 2008, 11:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I used to get annoyed when parents took their kids out for weeks at a time on independent study. Not until I came to Folsom did I experience the volume of requests I see here at my current school. In my prior district, Independent Study contracts were very unusual and only for very extreme circumstances.

It doesn't bother me much now because I have grown accustomed to the half dozen requests I get for it every year. Why was I bothered? It's difficult to know exactly where we're going to be and how fast we're going to progress through certain material. So, I must guess at where I hope we'll be when the student leaves, how much we will cover while he or she is away, and where we'll be when the student returns.

My students do a major research project at a certain point in the year, and most of the work is done in class. Different kids progress through the process at different rates. Plus, I've had parents tell me that where they're going, they will not have access to computers and/or they don't really want to cart all of the student's textbooks along on their trip. I've also had students and parents complain that I have assigned too much work for a given independent study period. What they forget is that I am obligated to assign the same amount of work they would be doing if they were with the rest of the class in school. That IS a lot of work. I have an obligation to keep the student on pace with the class and grade level expectations.

It is due to these reasons that many teachers bristle at requests for independent study. Your reason for requesting it was valid, but perhaps the tension you sensed from the teacher was exasperation at the situation in general.

About the phone -- kids who text could be cheating. They could be gossiping. They could be photographing students and sending those photos to others who alter them on photoshop and post them to MYSpace or YouTube. The rule against texting is to protect the privacy and rights of the student population at large. I agree that your property should be returned if you request it. However, if it is an on-going problem, schools have to have some recourse because they must consider the safety and rights of all students who could be adversely affected by your child's misconduct. While your child's second offense followed an innocent mistake, many other students' first offenses aren't mistakes. They definitely abuse the rules and the patience and understanding of teachers, etc. It's a much bigger picture than people realize.


Pari.






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