52 replies to this topic

[camay2327]

If  you purchase a firearm make sure you practice practice practice with it.  My brother in-law bought a 12 gauge for home defense but had not ever fired it.  I had to take him out and teach him how to use it.  Gawd, can you imagine being in a defense situation and not even knowing how to load the weapon?

 

All that said, consider a taser for a couple of reasons.  #1 People tend to fear a taser more than a firearm. #2 Lighting someone up with a taser does not carry the same consequence as using a firearm.  #3  You need not hesitate using the taser as the consequences are much less.

 

JC

And if you have two or more coming in, what good does a taser do for the 2nd and 3rd persons?

 

A pump shotgun normally has 5-7 shells in it. It would work well for just one person.

[ducky]

And if you have two or more coming in, what good does a taser do for the 2nd and 3rd persons?

 

A pump shotgun normally has 5-7 shells in it. It would work well for just one person.

 

Good point.  Also, with a Taser you need to be close to your assailant.   That means a risk of a struggle and having it taken from you and turned on you instead.

A shotgun would be the best for the reasons others have listed.  

If you really don't want a gun in the house, another option is bear deterrent spray.  It works from 12 to 30 feet away.  Way less expensive than a gun, too.

[Robert Gary]

Again, if you're planning on using the firearm for home defense consider something that accepts home defense rounds that do not penetrate walls. Even a little .22 will go right through walls like butter. You don't want to hit a family member or neighbor.

-Robert

[supermom]

Pepper spray inside your own home is a terrifically horrible idea to deploy. Especially if you have anyone in your family with asthma or a flu, or you are just frankly, too poor to afford a hotel for a night or two. Pepper spray is illegal to deploy indoors for security guards because it has been acknowledged as more of a deterrent for the victim to ever use again, than for a bad guy to worry about being hit with again. 

Best home defense is still a cast iron pan for close and personal, or a (as legally short as possible) shot gun with bird or sand shot or rock salts

[ducky]

I forgot to mention it, folsom500, but I figured it went without saying.  Don't practice with pepper spray indoors or outside on a breezy day.

 

I also have never liked the idea of a Taser because I'm the kind of person that forgets to keep their phone charged.  Even law enforcement seems to have problems with them working 100 percent of the time.

[Robert Gary]

Pepper spray inside your own home is a terrifically horrible idea to deploy. Especially if you have anyone in your family with asthma or a flu, or you are just frankly, too poor to afford a hotel for a night or two. Pepper spray is illegal to deploy indoors for security guards because it has been acknowledged as more of a deterrent for the victim to ever use again, than for a bad guy to worry about being hit with again. 
Best home defense is still a cast iron pan for close and personal, or a (as legally short as possible) shot gun with bird or sand shot or rock salts

Maybe just don't use it on a regular basis and save it for occasional use. It would be extraordinary if you needed it once a lifetime indoors.

-Robert

[supermom]

Maybe just don't use it on a regular basis and save it for occasional use. It would be extraordinary if you needed it once a lifetime indoors.

-Robert

The same,my dear, could be said about a shot gun. 

 

Merely a different perspective I am offering.

[camay2327]

Just get a shotgun.

[folsom500]

I appreciate all the responses and comments and have some thoughts. 

I am still on the fence about getting a gun and or shotgun for the house.  If I did, I would certainly take a course and use the range to get some practical experience on how to use them.

I would not consider a taser or pepper spray over what I have currently for reasons stated by others.  Neither are a good choice for inside home defense assuming a break in- not knowing if they are armed or how many. 

On the matter of low cost- as has been stated here and in review of the gun that I was considering, it appears to have good reviews and seems to be a reliable and accurate fire arm.  The same goes for the low cost Shotgun that I have looked at. 

Considering that these are for purely defensive purposes, in the home, and not likely to be ever used, other than an occasional trip to the range- why not use a lower cost good rated fire arm.

 

I guess time will be the determining factor in a decision to obtain a gun or shotgun, but if I do it seems the shot gun would be the first choice.

 

On the lethality of guns and shotguns- I have have looked at non lethal rounds for both.  They do exist in rubber and even rubber with pepper spray rounds. 

 

For me now- as CW suggests- maybe my 'on hand weaponry' is sufficient for now...  Maybe a few more months being alone will sort things out...

[cw68]

F500, you can always put me on your speed dial, I'll be back in the NS 'hood March 1.

[ghost35me]

Hi Folsom500,

 

I'm not an expert in guns and such. But I recently had similar discussions (triggered by recent local shootings in the greater Sac region) on this topic with a buddy who is in law enforcement. He recommended that one should consider scenarios first that are specific to your living situation (type of housing, housing layout, who and how many people live there, their defensive capabilities, etc) and the types of intrusions you'll encounter (even consider reasonable but unlikely situations). With that as a starting point, consider how to defend first the property from intrusion (fortify points of entry) as well as responses to an intrusion. Basically, think in layers of preventing unwanted events. Prevent someone from choosing your residence. Prevent someone from entering. Prevent someone from harming you once entered. Etc. Specifically, he advised not thinking about weapons as a starting point, but rather as an end point of last resort that's part of an overall prevention strategy.

 

But when that last resort is reached, you must have a compelling response that will stop an attack; at this point, you get one chance to respond in the interest of survival. He suggested that I get some hands-on experience first before buying anything; that will strongly influence what one believes will be effective depending on the situation. Lots of misconceptions in the media, TVs and movies. Handguns requires skills and have limited effectiveness. Shotgun may be highly situation dependent and contraindicated in many scenarios. Rifles are effective but cumbersome. Nothing is perfect for every situation and so a pre-thought out strategy is key and then figure out what tools are required for the strategy.

 

Anyway, again, I'm not an expert. Just passing on some thoughts given to me for consideration. Good luck.

[Chris]

Hey F500, please don't go "cheap" on a handgun.  100% operational reliability is what you want.  Cheap means jams, stove piping, jams, and more jams.  I suggest SIG or HK.  Probably in 9 mm is best for your situation.  I like a safety on a semi automatic as my personal preference.  Also look up Ruger and their revolvers.    Look up the Pink Pistols and arrange to go to one of their shoots.  You will learn more there than from anything else.  They are a great group of folks and are very welcoming to new shooters.  A gal friend of mine at work who shoots with me went out to one of their shoots and had the best time and was very welcomed.  Once you do get a handgun be sure to practice and know the weapon inside and out.  Also, make sure it is locked up at all times in your home with access only allowed by you.  Gun safes and trigger locks are a necessity when it comes to gun ownership.  Regards, Chris 

[Birdie]

I bought a hand gun back in the early 80s when I was getting divorced and living in a fairly isolated place.  I went into a gun shop and tried different guns to see what fit my hand best.  I wanted a fairly small gun so no chance of someone taking it from me like can happen with a rifle;  I bought a S&W 38 special.  I shot if quite a bit in the few years after I bought it, and then had kids, etc and have not shot it in years and years.  Kids grew up and I am single again, so I will go to the range and get familiar with it again.  

 

I do keep it loaded and handy unless I am traveling or have company with small kids.  Then I lock it in my safe.  

 

I was raised by a gun collector Dad who taught his daughters to shoot all sorts of guns for hobby, not protection.  However my sister and I both have guns for protection.  I would not hesitate to use it if my life was threatened, but have a lot of respect for gun.  I learned to shoot when I was too small to stand up and shoot a rifle.  We would lie down on a blanket and shoot.  

 

So, consider what situations you might think you would need a gun and decide if a shotgun or pistol would fit you best.  Maybe to to Wild sports or that gun shop in Folsom and hold some guns and see what feels comfortable.  The people in gun stores can advise you also.

 

Whatever you do, definitely go to the range (Folsom cordova is the one that I know of) and get comfortable with your gun or maybe they will let you try some out.  My boys did gun training through Boy Scouts at that range and the owner had a son in Scouts.  The most important thing with a gun is that if you plan on owning one, you need to know how to use it. Because in a stressful situation you will be more prone to panic and not remember what you were taught.

 

Good luck, it's a big decision.  I wouldn't be without my pistol...though I have an alarm on my house too.  

[caligirlz]

shotguns are the best.  any intruder would run just hearing you cock it.  load it with birdshot.

 

 

Fully agree a shotgun is the way to go. Just the sound of a shotgun being "racked" will solve 99% of the problems. Even Bears know that sound. If you do pull the trigger, Bird shot <snip>

 

Hand guns are for close contact and may require multi shots to take down the threat ,thats why cop's normally fire multi shots.

 

I recently took a CCW class and asked the instructor these exact questions, because every lay gunman I talked to told me these things.

 

Agreed, shotguns are good for HD, have good spray. BUT, birdshot, bean bags, rock salt are not recommended.

If you are in your house, and you feel like your life is in danger, then you can shoot. No warning shots or verbal warning are required. However, verbal warning is for the purpose of your protection, in the case that there are witnesses.

Also, those shots aren't going to necessarily stop or kill the intruder. If your life is threatened, do you really want to shot to injure and slow down? There's no guarantee that an injured intruder is no longer at risk of threatening your life. Everything I'm reading/hearing now says to keep your gun trained on the injured intruder until the cops arrive, as injured people have been known to rise & re-engage. Another consideration is how quickly an intruder or stalker can cover the distance between the two of you, say 10 feet. You wouldn't even have time to think, let alone raise your weapon.

 

Its recommended that in addition to range time shooting at a static target, to also include some type of tactical training also. Many of the local gun clubs/ranges offer this type of training.

 

The other consideration is depending on your house, an intruder on the outside may not hear you rack your shotgun. I agree with whomever mentioned it above, it you are going to get a shotgun for HD, get one that holds more than 1-2 shots.

 

As for handguns vs long arm guns for HD, the floor plan of your house should be taken into consideration. If you have long hallways (shooting galleries), then the long arm gun would be good for you, versus those who have houses with lots of angles, shorter hallways & rooms. A handgun or short barrel shotgun would be better in this case. Of course, all depends on the experience of the gun owner.

 

I still a newbie at all of this, but one thing my instructor mentioned was to use special ammo for your HD/CCW, I don't know what type/caliber of ammo the cops use, or if they have specific restrictions.

 

I follow a website that talks about self protection. They analyze videos and articles with the purpose of getting one thinking about self awareness, and it's not just about guns. Check it out. https://activeselfprotection.com/

[ghost35me]

First, I don't understand the comments about scaring away intruders with the sound of 'racking' the shotgun. Why would you give away any tactical advantage you have by announcing your presence, possibly your location and the fact that you are armed with a particular weapon? Especially if you don't know where and how many attackers you're facing? Second, why isn't the gun loaded and ready in the first place? Is one waiting for the last minute to chamber a round? What if you get surprised by a hidden attacker? Or one that moves quickly?  Or what if the attacker is basically chasing you and you only have time to reach the weapon and shoot - an empty weapon will be a liability at that point.

 

If you have a weapon that you intend to use for defense, it should be loaded and ready (but in a safe condition) at all times.

 

 

A shotgun is probably not my first choice for HD. I've tried shooting handguns, shotguns and rifles this year. The benefit of a shotgun is that, depending on the setup, you may not have aim precisely. On the other hand, that could be a cause for concern. The problem is that they tend to be very unwieldy -- they are long and heavy and not very maneuverable. That could be a problem in itself. 

 

Not meant to be comprehensive and there are exceptions. Just some thoughts that come to mind:

 

Handgun (semi-auto, not revolver):

pros: maneuverable. light, easy to carry. easy to use ambidextrously. multiple rounds before needing to reload. easy and fast to reload. easy to use with a hand held light. good for corners (if you absolutely must walk -- ie - to get to your kid's room)

cons: harder to aim and use quickly for distances farther than 7 meters (which may be sufficient for households). Keep in mind that 7 meters is only 2 seconds away. may require multiple shots to stop a threat. aiming / shooting quickly is a perishable skill.

 

Shotgun:

pros: potential for wide shot pattern. effective in stopping a threat. rifles are quick to aim (less skill required). good for when you are covered behind a choke point.

cons: heavy and hard to maneuver. limited number of rounds before needing to reload. slow reload. not easy to use with hand held light. not a good choice for corners. recoil may be too much depending on the shooter. depending on action, can be subject to misloading issues.

 

Rifle (AR15 type):

pros: very precise. quick to aim (less proficiency than handgun required). effective rounds. multiple rounds before reload required. easy and quick to reload. round generally tumbles and becomes ineffective after passing through barriers. minimal recoil - easy to manage for quick follow-up shots if required. proven reliability.

cons: harder to maneuver relative to handgun. not a good choice for corners.

 

For me, in my house, in my location, I would choose an AR first with handgun backup. 

 

Caligirl, you want to use something like a jacketed hollow point (JHP) for handguns. Gold Dot is a popular brand.

 

Whatever one chooses, it only counts if you can hit the attacker. I recommend you try shooting each choice at a range that allows you to shoot quickly, shoot multiple targets, shoot moving targets, shoot while moving etc (all the things you might be doing in a real situation) at different distances you deem appropriate for scenarios you think likely.

 

Different people in different environments in different situations call for different tools and tactics. Try before you buy.