132 replies to this topic

[Chris]

4x more people were killed by lawnmowers than AR15's in the last decade.  Perspective people.

Exactly Joe, but not one of the gun grabbing leftists here will recognize that fact..........  Nor have they thought if they do grab all the guns from we law abiding citizens (good luck with that, raise your hand to be on that team) they fail to think the whole operation out.  Criminals will not turn in their guns and then we will be at their mercy.  And the left wing MSM will stop recording gun deaths in the news because it will not fit their agenda.  Just like they never report defensive gun use in this country that saves a lot more than 17 lives every day.  The millions of us who will be robbed, killed, assaulted, and raped by the criminals who happily did not turn in their guns.  Clubs and hammers are used to kill people every year by more than 2 to 1 vs an AR type rifle.   I have a lot of hammers and I do not want to register them.  Chris

[Who_Do_You_Trust]

4x more people were killed by lawnmowers than AR15's in the last decade.  Perspective people.

 

Every time someone uses an analogy like this, it demonstrates a gap in critical thinking.  If lawn mowers were indeed more lethal than AR-15's then they should issues lawn mowers to SWAT teams.  After all, you can kill more with a lawn mower than an AR-15.  Right???    Anyone seen a SWAT team armed with lawn mowers???

 

Perspective is good.  Critical thinking is better.

 

Joe,  Please do your statistical analyses properly.  Raw incidents often give a very misleading view.  You need to look at incidents per population to get a proper statistical perspective. Yes, lawn mowers have killed more than AR-15s, but that result should be expected because 4-5 million people own an AR-15 (NRA estimate), while 178 million own lawn mowers (Consumer Reports). 

 

Just saying that more people have died from this rather than that makes no sense at all.  Using that logic, more people die in hospitals than by firearms.  Does that mean hospitals are more dangerous than a firearm?  If true, a hospital is the last place you want to go when shot by a firearm.  Right?  No, it's not right.

 

Critical thinking!!!

[Who_Do_You_Trust]

Yep, keep on doing your thing lefties.... 2018 is going to sting at the ballot box...

 

Too bad they didn't include a survey of young adults between the ages of 18 - 21, many of whom are the ones actually dodging the bullets.  What do you think their preferences will be?

[Who_Do_You_Trust]

Walmart just announced they will stop selling firearms and ammo to anyone under 21 years of age.  Dick's Sporting Goods said the same yesterday.  If the gov't won't act, then corporations seem willing to act.

 

Joe - do you think the "favorable" ratings for Walmart will drop now?  It won't matter.  People don't go to Walmart for political edification.  They go for the cheap prices.  As for the other companies cutting ties with the NRA.  In two weeks, no one will care.

 

Saw an interesting note - Monday - Delta Airlines stopped offering discounts to NRA members.  Wednesday - Georgia Lt. Gov threatens to veto any legislation that might benefit Delta tax-wise (Delta HQ is in Atlanta).  Today,  a rumor has been floating around that Delta might move their HQ to another state and take 40,000 jobs with them.   Your move, Georgia Lt. Gov.            

[Chris]

Actually with the current liberal logic companies that make Hammers should be very afraid.........   Estwing, I pray for you.........

 

[The Average Joe]

Companies are free to endorse whatever they want. Consumers like me don't want politics with their shopping.  I notice the lefties get up in arms and run people out of business because they won't bake a gay wedding cake, but I don't think they feel the same about having to force businesses to comply with Constitutional rights like say, the 2nd Amendment.  Or say, make that asshat Kimmel do monologues about liberals because...equality!

But then, they never do hold themselves to the standards they demand we all follow...

[The Average Joe]

 

Too bad they didn't include a survey of young adults between the ages of 18 - 21, many of whom are the ones actually dodging the bullets.  What do you think their preferences will be?

 

Yeah, like I want a bunch of tide pod eaters setting policy.  Young adults tend to be pretty naive and self important these days. Stupid self esteem movement. Not to mention the blatant indoctrination in our schools.. It will take decades for them to unlearn all the crap they have to absorb.  They are certainly less mature than previous generations at the same age. I deal with 18-23 year old "young adults" all the time. Call me generally unimpressed.

[The Average Joe]

Funny thing. The left wants to lower the voting age, and wants us to listen to high school students to set policy. Then wants to ban these same wise intellectual powerhouses from owning weapons until they are older?

 

So which is it?

[Who_Do_You_Trust]

Companies are free to endorse whatever they want. Consumers like me don't want politics with their shopping.  I notice the lefties get up in arms and run people out of business because they won't bake a gay wedding cake, but I don't think they feel the same about having to force businesses to comply with Constitutional rights like say, the 2nd Amendment.  Or say, make that asshat Kimmel do monologues about liberals because...equality!

But then, they never do hold themselves to the standards they demand we all follow...

 

You may not understand exactly how the Bill of Rights works.  It prevents only the government from infringing your rights.  The Bill of Rights does not extend onto private property, nor are private citizens (including corporations) required to comply with it.  If you are on my property, or in my store, I can infringe most of your rights outlined in the Bill of Rights.  I can limit your speech, deny your freedom to assemble, deny you a right to a fair trial if you break one of my rules, prevent you from possessing a firearm, among many other denials of rights.    

[Who_Do_You_Trust]

Funny thing. The left wants to lower the voting age, and wants us to listen to high school students to set policy. Then wants to ban these same wise intellectual powerhouses from owning weapons until they are older?

 

So which is it?

 

Americans have been horribly schizophrenic when it comes to determining the age when a child becomes an "adult".  To wit:

 

You're an adult at the age of 10 at the ticket window at Disneyland

You're an adult at the age of 12 at the ticket window for a movie

You're an adult at the age of 16 at the DMV

You're an adult at the age of 18 at the draft board, at the voting booth, and at a casting call for a XXX movie

You're an adult at the age or 21 at the bar 

 

Wielding a vote and wielding a firearm can have dramatically different results.  In one case, those on the receiving end don't survive.  

[The Average Joe]

It was ineptly worded, but Puhlease. I understand EXACTLY what the Bill of Rights is for.  That is why I don't want those rights eroded by the very people (govt) it is supposed to protect me from. 

 

So in your examples of business not having to follow the Constitution (which I have warned about on many occasions esp. social media which is free to ban any speech it deems "hateful"), why are they forced to serve gay weddings? Gay weddings are not in the Constitution...since the government can force people to do business that violates their beliefs, why can't it compel  others to do business with those beliefs they oppose?

 

Funny how the compulsion always seems to go in one direction...

[Who_Do_You_Trust]

It was ineptly worded, but Puhlease. I understand EXACTLY what the Bill of Rights is for.  That is why I don't want those rights eroded by the very people (govt) it is supposed to protect me from. 

 

So in your examples of business not having to follow the Constitution (which I have warned about on many occasions esp. social media which is free to ban any speech it deems "hateful"), why are they forced to serve gay weddings? Gay weddings are not in the Constitution...since the government can force people to do business that violates their beliefs, why can't it compel  others to do business with those beliefs they oppose?

 

Funny how the compulsion always seems to go in one direction...

 

You actually don't seem to know exactly how all this works.  

 

The Bill of Rights does not extend onto private property.  Individuals and companies aren't required to respect your rights when you are on their property.  

 

So then, why can a business be forced to provide a wedding cake to a gay couple?   We have federal and state anti-discrimination laws.  These laws protect individuals from discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, or national origin.  Many states add other protected classes to this list such as LBGT individuals, elderly (age discrimination), and physically impaired individuals.  I believe the wedding cake incident was in Colorado which does include LBGT as a protected class from discrimination.   BTW, the bakery owner has taken the case all the way to the supreme count and a ruling is expected next June.

[Who_Do_You_Trust]

Did a little research today to find out why so many companies are distancing themselves from the NRA.  Eliminating discounts to NRA members or limiting the sales of firearms in many ways.   What I found was quite interesting.

 

Companies are NOT making these decisions because of the voice of their customers.  They are making these decisions because of the voice of their employees.  Today, most corporations listen carefully to what their employees are saying and thinking.  And the message was expressed well today when the employees of Delta Airlines made the statement, "Our values are not for sale."   they're referring to a law passed yesterday by the Georgia legislature that eliminates a fuel tax break for the airline and will cost Delta several $million a year.  Loss of this tax break will be inconsequential to Delta.  Their quarterly revenue for Q4 of 2017 was $10.2B.  So if the tax break was $5M, that's 0.012% of annual revenue, literally a drop in the bucket.

 

All of the sporting good companies that made their decisions to limit gun sales in several ways were driven by employee demands, not customer pressure.  Same for the rental car companies.  this was a surprise to me, but understandable.  "Our values are not for sale."   Good for them.  too bad our elected representatives don't ascribe to the same philosophy.

[Who_Do_You_Trust]

Another interesting development in the firearms debate happened this week.  And if this doesn't convince you that the NRA's only interest is in the health of the gun manufacturing industry, nothing will.

 

All of the sudden, modest gun control restrictions are being adopted everywhere, the latest being Florida's governor signing several gun restriction laws today.  You might think lawmakers are finally listening to their constituents after the Parkland shootings. but there is another explanation for the Republicans' talk of modest gun restrictions:  MONEY. 

 

Gun manufacturers are in the midst of the worst business crisis in decades, with double digit sales drops driving some to the brink of bankruptcy.  The NRA, which gets much of its funding from major gunmakers, is trying to help.  Nothing gooses gun sales like the threat of new gun control measures.  The NRA has given lawmakers the green light to float new gun limits without the threat of retribution.  Debating and introducing gun control policies are good for business.

 

It may seem counter-intuitive that gun manufacturers have suffered during Trump's first year, but firearms sales are down across the industry.  The combined revenues of Strum, Ruger & Co, Vista Outdoors, Winchester, Remington, and American Outdoor Brands (formerly Smith & Wesson) fell 13% in 2017.  It's the largest year-over-year drop since 2000.  Gunmakers have cut back production and slashed payrolls as a result.  And the slide shows no signs of stopping.  Two days before Parkland, Remington announced it would seek chapter 11 bankruptcy protection after its sales took a 30% nosedive.

 

As it turns out, in the gun industry fear is good for the bottom line.  Under Obama, gun owners rushed to buy firepower they feared was going to be outlawed (which never happened).  When Trump took office, gun owners thought they had everything they needed.  The stockpiling mentality died, and along with it, gun sales.  Last October, the month a shooter killed 58 and injured 851 at a Las Vegas concert - the deadliest mass shooting in US history - background checks were down 13% from the previous year.  Nobody thought they needed to go buy more guns.

 

So it's a little ironic that the NRA spent $54M in 2016 to help Trump and other gun friendly Republicans get elected. Now the entire industry is threatened.  Had Hillary won, gun sales would be soaring right now.  It's clear that gun manufacturing management are a bunch of amateurs.  They don't understand their market nor their customers. If you own any of their stock, dump it now.

 

Keep in mind that 41 of the 76 NRA board members either come from, or are connected to, the firearms manufacturing industry.  So the next time you hear the NRA crowing about protecting the second amendment, remember that their values are indeed for sale, and their love for money trumps any thoughts of protecting 2A rights.

[Who_Do_You_Trust]

This is what can happen when teachers carry firearms into the classroom.  From the Sac Bee:

 

Dennis Alexander told his California high school class Tuesday that he was going to check his pistol to be sure it was unloaded before conducting a lesson on disarming an attacker. Then a single gunshot rang out.  Alexander had accidentally fired into the ceiling during his administration of justice class at Seaside High School, reported KSBW. Two teens were hit by debris falling from the ceiling, while a third was hit by fragments from the ricocheting bullet. Alexander apologized and the class continued. Alexander is also a reserve police officer in nearby Sand City on Monterey Bay.   Fermin Gonzales told KSBW that his 17-year-old son came home from school with blood on his shirt and bullet fragments in his neck.  “He’s shaken up but he’s going to be OK,” Gonzales said. “I’m just pretty upset that no one told us anything and we had to call the police ourselves to report it.”

 

It appears now that our students not only need to worry about "bad guys" shooting up the classrooms, but treachers shooting up the classrooms too.  This situation could have been much worse.

 

As stated before, the pro-gun people think the best solution to shooters at schools is to bring in more guns.  When we have drugs killing people, we don't ask the drug dealers to bring in more drugs.