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#76 forumreader

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Posted 05 November 2005 - 07:28 AM

Has anyone heard more news about needle sales in surrounding communities?

#77 tessieca

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Posted 05 November 2005 - 01:06 PM

Rancho Cordova and Elk Grove voted against it. I believe the county supervisors narrowly voted it down as well.
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#78 caspertheghost

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 06:44 PM

Be it free neddles or not, there will still be shooting up drugs. Folsom doesn't need a free neddle program though, they sure don't!
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#79 Mypintobean

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Posted 08 January 2006 - 07:37 PM

QUOTE(bishmasterb @ Sep 26 2005, 06:18 PM) View Post

Prohibiting needle sales to curb drug use makes about as much sense as prohibiting glasses to curb alcohol use.

Now that I think about it, that's a great idea! A ban on cups and glasses. The scourge of alcohol will be banished from the land forever! Man, I really need to become a politician.



When I was driving to California I went thru a town in TX that had outlawed glass. They had a big problem with people busting bottles on other peoples houses.

As far as the needles go, People are going to be junkies no matter what. If we can't stop them at least we can make them more responsable with their actions. All these people against a needle program would be supprised how many people are I.V. drug users, probabily someone you know but don't know it. They should do an exchange program though so they know they dirty needles arn't left lying around with a small fee to cover cost. If your going to argue that we are inabling them well most stores sell rolling papers don't they? How many people do you know roll their own cigs????

#80 FolsomJunior00

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Posted 09 January 2006 - 06:18 PM

I really hope we dont start a free needle program. I am making so much by selling these suckers, I could build a new arena for the Kings myself!!! lmaosmiley.gif
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#81 camay2327

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Posted 09 January 2006 - 07:37 PM

I don't know where Mypintobean came from but we will not have a free needle program here......

I for one do not want used needles laying all over Folsom for people to get infected with...
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#82 Mypintobean

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Posted 09 January 2006 - 07:55 PM

Which if you read my post I said they should have a needle exchange, you have to bring back the needles you use, to get new needles. That way they are not laying all over the place.

#83 CataBird

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Posted 11 January 2006 - 05:47 PM

QUOTE(caspertheghost @ Nov 9 2005, 06:44 PM) View Post

Be it free neddles or not, there will still be shooting up drugs. Folsom doesn't need a free neddle program though, they sure don't!


Casper,

I don't know where you got the idea this topic was about Sac County considering a free needle program, but that info is inaccurate. There was a law passed by CA legislature that allows counties to decide whether they want to allow hypodermic needles to be sold over-the-counter at pharmacies without requiring prescriptions.

This law was enacted because a SMALL percentage of Californians (15%? I think) use needles to inject their insulin on a daily basis, and they wanted to be able to buy fresh needles at their local pharmacies without having to prove they have a prescription for their meds.

However, that would also allow anyone to purchase needles without prescriptions--including illicit drug users who "shoot up" to get high. This would result in a LOT of discarded dirty needles littering the streets--a dangerous situation for all citizens, as many drug users have STD's and other serious illnesses.
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#84 Steve Heard

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Posted 11 January 2006 - 06:30 PM

QUOTE(CataBird @ Jan 11 2006, 05:47 PM) View Post

Casper,

I don't know where you got the idea this topic was about Sac County considering a free needle program, but that info is inaccurate. There was a law passed by CA legislature that allows counties to decide whether they want to allow hypodermic needles to be sold over-the-counter at pharmacies without requiring prescriptions.

This law was enacted because a SMALL percentage of Californians (15%? I think) use needles to inject their insulin on a daily basis, and they wanted to be able to buy fresh needles at their local pharmacies without having to prove they have a prescription for their meds.

However, that would also allow anyone to purchase needles without prescriptions--including illicit drug users who "shoot up" to get high. This would result in a LOT of discarded dirty needles littering the streets--a dangerous situation for all citizens, as many drug users have STD's and other serious illnesses.

Hold the presses! Catabird and I see eye to eye.

Even if there was an exchange, can we really count on a zoned out junkie to save the dirty needle after shooting up? I wouldn't want 1 single neede being discarded in our parks or on our streets.

Bad idea.

Now, allow the liberal in me to suggest SUPERVISED clean needle injections by trained healthcare workers. The junkie shows up with his bag and the healthcare worker prepares the dope and shoots him up. Whaddya think?

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#85 Mypintobean

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Posted 11 January 2006 - 06:41 PM

This is the results of a study on needle exchange and buying needles w/o perscription

NEP- needle exchange program
IDU-interveins drug user

The debate over the effect of NEPs on the number of discarded syringes is unique among the 14 research questions surrounding NEPs in that both opponents and advocates have claimed that the evidence favors their point of view. This question has been of concern both to members of the public and law enforcement officers, who fear needlestick injuries while searching suspects. Fortunately, theoretical analysis and empirical evidence can help resolve this issue.

Fifteen of the 33 US NEPs evaluated in this report operate on a one-for-one exchange basis and provide no syringes to IDUs presenting without a syringe at their first visit. These NEPs give clients one sterile syringe for every used syringe turned in to the NEP and thus cannot increase the total number of discarded syringes, although they could change the geographical distribution of the discarded syringes. Because a used syringe in a city with an NEP now has value (it can be exchanged for a sterile syringe), it is plausible that the discarding of syringes would decrease in much the same way as "bottle bills" have decreased discarded bottles and cans. IDUs might pick up discarded syringes to bring to the NEP to exchange; NEP staff confirm that this occurs.[105] Although 17 US NEPs do provide syringes to IDUs presenting to the NEP for the first time, these "starter needles" are few in number and are dwarfed by the overall number of syringes distributed by any NEP. Even those NEPs without one-for-one exchange rules or that provide starter needles do not diverge greatly from the one-for-one exchange condition; the NEPs in Portland, OR (one-for-one; provides three starter needles) and Vancouver, BC (not one-for-one; provides two starter needles) had 99% and 97% return rates in 1992. It is worth noting, however, that schemes that distribute or sell syringes through pharmacies do have the potential to increase the total number of discarded syringes, although this problem can be at least partially addressed by either distributing sharps containers with the syringes or providing a discount on syringe purchases if used syringes are returned.[45, 106]

Empirical studies confirm these theoretical predictions. The number of discarded syringes in the vicinity of the Portland NEP decreased by almost two-thirds after the NEP opened.[107] Because this research design cannot assess whether used syringes might have simply been discarded elsewhere in the city, it is useful to examine community-wide indices. In Toronto, ON the number of syringes collected by various community and governmental organizations appears to have decreased since the opening of the NEP.[108] In Amsterdam, the Netherlands, needlestick injuries reported by members of the general public to the Municipal Health Service have increased somewhat since the NEP opened, but a similar rise in reported needlestick injuries by the medical profession suggests that this is a reporting artifact due to increased awareness of needle-borne infections.[109]

Conclusion:

NEPs in the US have not been shown to increase the total number of discarded syringes and can be expected to result in fewer discarded syringes.

QUOTE(CataBird @ Jan 11 2006, 05:47 PM) View Post

Casper,

I don't know where you got the idea this topic was about Sac County considering a free needle program, but that info is inaccurate. There was a law passed by CA legislature that allows counties to decide whether they want to allow hypodermic needles to be sold over-the-counter at pharmacies without requiring prescriptions.

This law was enacted because a SMALL percentage of Californians (15%? I think) use needles to inject their insulin on a daily basis, and they wanted to be able to buy fresh needles at their local pharmacies without having to prove they have a prescription for their meds.

However, that would also allow anyone to purchase needles without prescriptions--including illicit drug users who "shoot up" to get high. This would result in a LOT of discarded dirty needles littering the streets--a dangerous situation for all citizens, as many drug users have STD's and other serious illnesses.




I think you ment bloodborne pathogens. STD's are a whole different thing that has nothing to due with needles

QUOTE(stevethedad @ Jan 11 2006, 06:30 PM) View Post

Hold the presses! Catabird and I see eye to eye.

Even if there was an exchange, can we really count on a zoned out junkie to save the dirty needle after shooting up? I wouldn't want 1 single neede being discarded in our parks or on our streets.

Bad idea.

Now, allow the liberal in me to suggest SUPERVISED clean needle injections by trained healthcare workers. The junkie shows up with his bag and the healthcare worker prepares the dope and shoots him up. Whaddya think?



I think no junkie is going to waste his time to get his stuff then wait to get to the clinic wait his turn and all that just to shoot up. You would be supprised who well a needle exchange works, especially since needles can be hard to come by. Do most of you really think that Junkies want A.I.D.S. or hepitits or anything. They would gladly get a new needle. Plus do you realize how quick needles dull then it hurts. (I'm in the medical profession). You have a bigger chance of people leaving needles around with out an exchange program than with one. And if you think just because you don't have one you will have fewer junkies useing needles your wrong. This town will have people shooting dope either way.

And just to give you some background on "street smarts". I had a parent that was a junkie growing up who is now clean and I lived on the streets for a while. I never used but alot of people around me did. I never wanted to end up like my parent.

Edited by Mypintobean, 11 January 2006 - 07:23 PM.


#86 Steve Heard

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Posted 11 January 2006 - 08:42 PM

Pinto

That may all be true, but I'd prefer a treatment program to get people off of heroin, rather than a needle program to keep them on it.

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#87 Mypintobean

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Posted 11 January 2006 - 10:08 PM

QUOTE(stevethedad @ Jan 11 2006, 08:42 PM) View Post

Pinto

That may all be true, but I'd prefer a treatment program to get people off of heroin, rather than a needle program to keep them on it.



I TOTALY agree you. But needle exchanges aren't just for junkies they are for anyone who has to self medicate. Like poor people with diabeites.

#88 CataBird

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Posted 25 January 2006 - 02:47 PM

QUOTE(Mypintobean @ Jan 11 2006, 10:08 PM) View Post

I TOTALY agree you. But needle exchanges aren't just for junkies they are for anyone who has to self medicate. Like poor people with diabeites.


What's the difference between self-medicating diabetics getting their needles WITH a prescription as opposed to ANY person buying needles at a pharmacy?

The difference is: ANY person can be a drug addict who shoots up and drops their needles, where-as PRESCRIPTION-required purchases serve only those who need the needles for their valid medical condition.

The FACT that drug addicts are irresponsible is proven by the fact that no responsible individual would BE a drug addict. Ergo, a community that does not have a discarded needle problem should not START providing needles to just ANY person, because doing so would CAUSE a discarded needle problem.

Diabetics already HAVE prescriptions for their meds--and usually get the needles they need WITH their medications. It's cheaper for them to purchase kits that include all the necessities for their illness than it is for them to purchase each item separately.

So, providing syringes and needles to non-prescription holders is UNnecessary and foolhardy, to say the least.
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