27 replies to this topic

[Michael Hughes]

New Article in Folsom Telegraph

http://www.folsomtel...ries/03mold.txt

[EDF]

While I don't know the whole story on this deal I have had some dealing with mold....

The first thing of course these folks did was hire an stinking attorney....

I read that of course they not only want the developer to buy back the units, they want damages for "suffering"....

Now.... if they did in fact hide this issue... then shame on them and I hope they have some insurance to cover this...

If they didn't know about it, then they should be allowed to remediate it and the condo owners should let them in to investigate it othewise, I am of the opinion they are just after $$$ because of the down turn in the real estate market...

There are condos that could be converted over in the Oak Ave, Bidwell and Blue Ravine triangle, but my understanding is the reason they won't be is because the "former owner" is worried about lawsuits like this that could come back to them....

I know there are alwasy two sides to every story so we'll see how this one plays out...

I remember about 30 owners over in the Hillsborough neighborhood in Lexington Hills put together 3k each and hired an attorney because of some defects and they all settled for some serious $$$... and by the way, I know that some of them never used the money to fix their houses... they took it and ran... and guess what... over time no one remembers this...

I hope folks who sell homes over there are disclosing this fact.....it might make a difference in a sale now... but when the market is hot... who cares...

[FolsomBarb]

The first thing of course these folks did was hire an stinking attorney....

Perhaps you should update your knowledge of this topic before you pass judgement on what these folks have gone through and the fact that they hired a "stinking attorney".......

http://www.tomatopag...?showtopic=9177
http://www.tomatopag...?showtopic=9628

[DrKoz23]

Can I ask the question as to why the people who bought condos are now blaming the city?

http://www.kcra.com/...361/detail.html

Do any of the condo owners feel some of the responsibility lies with themselves? Was the initial report filed with the city a public document. If it was... they should have some responsibility... but seem to want to shed it all and blame just about anyone.

I feel for them... but why should the city bear any responsibility here... it is the condo owners against the property owners... that's about all I see.

Am I wrong?

[FolsomBarb]

Can I ask the question as to why the people who bought condos are now blaming the city?

A report that was prepared and filed with the city long before the conversion deal was approved points out suspected mold in nearly 200 units. The city did nothing to check this out prior to letting the conversion take place.

http://news.yahoo.co...lo_kcra/9729361

[DrKoz23]

A report that was prepared and filed with the city long before the conversion deal was approved points out suspected mold in nearly 200 units. The city did nothing to check this out prior to letting the conversion take place.

http://news.yahoo.co...lo_kcra/9729361

Yes... I understand.

But is it the city's responsibility?

Was this document filed with the city a PUBLIC document. If so... the people who purchased condos could have checked it out. That's what I want to know. If it was a public document (which it might not have been)... a little homework could have saved a lot of nighmares.

[bordercolliefan]

The question is why the city approved the conversion when it was aware of the mold problems. It raises the possibility that the city is so pro-developer that it failed to examine the conversion proposal with a critical eye and thereby jeopardized the health of city residents. --I'm not saying this is what occurred; I'm just saying this is the implication to which the city must respond.

It is also interesting that the report found mold in 200 units, while the owners are apparently still claiming the problem is limited to just 15 units.

It sounds to me like the developer better get ready to pony up some serious cash. With this report on file, it appears the developer has no chance of arguing that it was unaware of the mold problems or that the mold grew after the conversions.

It's always nice when the truth comes out so justice can be done.

[Robert Giacometti]

Yes... I understand.

But is it the city's responsibility?

Was this document filed with the city a PUBLIC document. If so... the people who purchased condos could have checked it out. That's what I want to know. If it was a public document (which it might not have been)... a little homework could have saved a lot of nighmares.

Remember back to when this issue was before the council....there was one maybe 2 council members who were "encouraging" staff to go back and review and maybe reconsider some standards.

Coincendently, Mr. Johnson announced he had accepted another position shortly after this issue was approved by council AFTER staff made some changes. Most everybody recognizes Mr. Johnson as being a pretty straight shooter and it was always questionable to me why a Director of Planning would leave a job where they were going to get the opportunity to annex and plan for 3600 acres for a position that he had turned down on other occassions. Maybe he got tired of being ordered by others what to do, when he knew it was wrong?

Isn't it interesting the one council person who seemd to be most vocal in attempting to dispell any questions as to why staff were leaving....may be the answer as to why staff actually left?

Although this issue doesn't involve the firefighters and the library worker, it is related. The real issue has been is that we have had inexperienced leadership at the top who got their job by reasons other than being qualified and THEY in turn protected a few loyal friends along the way, with the support of a council member. The Firefighters and Library staff experienced first hand double standards in enforcements of policies and that is the reason why they lost respect of their supervisors.

We the City are going to PAY again for our FAILED leadership! I just hope most of the citizens wake up and smell the coffee before its too late!

[Michael Hughes]

Remember back to when this issue was before the council....there was one maybe 2 council members who were "encouraging" staff to go back and review and maybe reconsider some standards.

Coincendently, Mr. Johnson announced he had accepted another position shortly after this issue was approved by council AFTER staff made some changes. Most everybody recognizes Mr. Johnson as being a pretty straight shooter and it was always questionable to me why a Director of Planning would leave a job where they were going to get the opportunity to annex and plan for 3600 acres for a position that he had turned down on other occassions. Maybe he got tired of being ordered by others what to do, when he knew it was wrong?

Isn't it interesting the one council person who seemd to be most vocal in attempting to dispell any questions as to why staff were leaving....may be the answer as to why staff actually left?

Although this issue doesn't involve the firefighters and the library worker, it is related. The real issue has been is that we have had inexperienced leadership at the top who got their job by reasons other than being qualified and THEY in turn protected a few loyal friends along the way, with the support of a council member. The Firefighters and Library staff experienced first hand double standards in enforcements of policies and that is the reason why they lost respect of their supervisors.

We the City are going to PAY again for our FAILED leadership! I just hope most of the citizens wake up and smell the coffee before its too late!

To answer all (or most) of the comments from this thread so far:

a) You should not pass judgement unless you know the whole situation. We are not just after "compensation" for the housing bubble bursting. These units have been diagnosed with Level 5 Mold at such a high percentage (over 80%) that the Department of Real Estate, lawyers, and even the Health Department said the only real solution is to demolish several of the buildings (where the mold is most severe). Said buildings include #'s 1 - 4 which are the owner occupied properties.

The other point of contention is the fact that the developer turned 283 units back into rentals when the DRE disclosures did not claim he could do this, making the transaction illegal. The disclosures clearly stated he could retain the units for future purposes should all not sell immediately, however, nowhere did it implicitly state to turn back into a rental property. The developer delayed us six months on getting access to our common facilities, turned the tennis courts in our disclosures into a parking lot, the kid's play area into a dumpster, and more.

b) The "mold report" took many teeth pullings to get. Also a document was filed with the city (which was public, and I have a copy of) AFTER the mold report that states a specific budget for the mold remediation, and guarantees that they will fix or have fixed the mold prior to move in. We did not find out how bad the mold was until we had private companies and the health department do tests. The "mold report" did not even touch on 20% of how bad the mold was.

Furthermore, this company owns Oak Brook at the Folsom Rancho border for those who don't know, and is doing the same thing there. They have applied for a condo-conversion, however, they are now trying to claim they will keep it rentals. Oak Brook has as bad and worse mold than Waterford. One of the renters here was moved over there while their unit was being "remediated". The Oak Brook Unit had the entire wall between the Water Heater and unit black with mold and so wet you could push through it. Mold was also present throughout the entire unit at Oak Brook. When contacted about this, Prometheus locked the renter out of both her Waterford and Prometheus properties, destroyed most of her possessions without her knowledge (yes you heard this right) claiming they were infected with mold, and doing this for her protection, and refused her access to any of her remainign things or her kid's things in either property.

c) People are or have been quitting the city in fair numbers right now for those who don't know. The writing is on the wall. People are blaming the city, because the day we found out about this we talked with Steve Miklos (City Council) and Amy Feagan (Housing) who both came out to our complex, spoke with all 30 + owners, and stated they would assist us in the lawsuit, do their own investigations, gave us all their cards, told us to come down to the city, we would get assistance, blah blah blah. As soon as the heat turned up on the issue they ran. I called up Amy's office over the last two weeks and was asked who I was. I informed who I was to whoever answered the phone each time and was told:

1) (Monday) She is sick, she will be back tomorrow
2) (Tuesday) She is on vacation, has been since Friday, will be back Thursday
3) (Wednesday) She is still sick will be back Friday
4) (Thursday) She is out of town on a conference and has been since Tuesday
5) (Friday) She is out of the office for the day, she took a long weekend

They will not return our phone calls or our emails, and have cut of all avenues of discussion. Folsom is shooting themselves in the foot and for those owners that are suing, Folsom is now more than likely going to be party to the lawsuit (I am conjecturing) since their actions seem more like covering up (or covering their own arses) than having best interest of public at heart.

[Barb J]

I completely feel for the people who purchased these condo's and I think that the people who knew there was a problem should be held accountable.

However, I wonder if the buyers had gotten a home inspection, wouldn't there have been a flag raised if the mold is as prevalent as it is??? I know that the realtor I work for has a mold disclosure included in the disclosure packet we send out to our Buyers - it advises everyone to have a mold inspection. A mold inspection is different from a regular home inspection but I would think a good home inspector would see signs of mold and inform the Buyer to have further testing.

Barb

[Waterford Renter]

Hi

Is there anything new about the Waterford Apartments and the MOLD issue?

I asked the manager but was told that everything was OK....

I have lived there now 4 years, and just found out not too long ago.
My 9 year old has Asthma but didnt know it was because of mold..
Any help or info would be great.....

Thank you ........

[mylo]

I agree

[tessieca]

Why is it any worse to allow conversion to condos than simply to rent the places with the mold in them? Why are people feeling sorry for the condo purchasers instead of the renters who lived in them as apartments?

The city's approval of condos didn't have any effect on the level of mold nor the fact that people were living in them with mold, so I don't see why it's the city's fault.

[Robert Giacometti]

Why is it any worse to allow conversion to condos than simply to rent the places with the mold in them? Why are people feeling sorry for the condo purchasers instead of the renters who lived in them as apartments?

The city's approval of condos didn't have any effect on the level of mold nor the fact that people were living in them with mold, so I don't see why it's the city's fault.

Tessieca,

Once the city got involved in the process through the conversion and discovered or should have discovered there was a mold problem, its probably reasonable to consider that, the city as stewards for the public, should have done something about this problem, before approving the conversion.

I've heard through some knowledgeable sources that one council member, really intervined behind the scences to get these condos approved despite staffs expressions of concerns.

Hopefully some of you are open minded enough to start to piece some of these things together and recognize what needs to be done.

[Deb aka Resume Lady]

Why is it any worse to allow conversion to condos than simply to rent the places with the mold in them? Why are people feeling sorry for the condo purchasers instead of the renters who lived in them as apartments?

I feel sorry for renters as well as condo owners, and both run the risk of mold-related health problems. But renters aren't "stuck" with the property; their leases will end and they can move on. Owners are stuck with defective condos. And the question is: Did the city know about the mold before converting the property, effectively hiding the defect from potential owners?