52 replies to this topic

[codywolf]

I am wondering where to find appropriate right of way information for using Folsom's bike paths? I am a
runner, and always run to the right on the paths. While running in the Parkway this has not been a problem, but on other trails in Folsom I have seen people walking and running on both sides of the path. Also, this morning I was screamed at by a bicyclist as I exited the bike path to cross Parkway drive. The bicyclist was trying to enter the path on the same side I was running on. Am I correct to stay to the right, or should I be doing something different?

[bishmasterb]

"Officially" I think runners are supposed to run on the left side, and riders on the right. The logic being, runners and bikers can see each other coming head on, and a runner won't accidentally step out in front of a bike (which might be easy to do if the cyclists were coming from behind at high speed).

I run and cycle in the Parkway a lot and since the dirt section is usually only on one-side of the path, I run on that side, ignoring whether it's right or left. I don't really think it's a problem as most of the cyclists in the Parkway are out for a casual ride and aren't going that fast.

In my humble opinion, the onus is on the cyclists. They are going much faster and should pay careful attention when they are passing runners/walkers, especially on neighborhood paths, like in the Parkway.

[Dave Burrell]

I was under the impression that everyone moving does so on the right side of the path - runners as well, and when a bicyclist approaches a pedestrian or runner - he/she passes to the left, going around them.

and a nice common courtesy - let the pedestrian/runner know that you are approaching to the left (verbal annoucement) course it also helps to slow down when a bicyclist is approaching a pedestrian on the path

the trails are for all to enjoy - runners and bicyclists alike, so we need to work together and be polite to one another to make it work

[folsom500]

I was under the impression that everyone moving does so on the right side of the path - runners as well, and when a bicyclist approaches a pedestrian or runner - he/she passes to the left, going around them.

and a nice common courtesy - let the pedestrian/runner know that you are approaching to the left (verbal annoucement) course it also helps to slow down when a bicyclist is approaching a pedestrian on the path

the trails are for all to enjoy - runners and bicyclists alike, so we need to work together and be polite to one another to make it work

As in the real world of streets and such- a pedestrian should ALWAYS walk on the opposite side of the street from the wheeled traffic flow...

Having said that - cyclist do HAVE a code of conduct that stipulates that they offer audible warning of their approach... this is NOT a coutesy but a CODE OF CONDUCT...

But having said THAT - -it is incumbent on any approaching person to take actions that would avoid an oncoming person, bike, etc.. and as in the real world of the road-- should that person strike from behind- it would be thier butt on the line, not the the other way around....

some bicyclist think they are elite and rule the trails... we have ways to deal with them.....


Cheers
F500

[s0479]

I've always heard....bikers on the right, people on the left. Similar to the road, so that you can see oncoming "traffic".

[Orangetj]

Speaking of rude people on those trails, why is it that every time I take my Harley for a nice casual ride through the Parkway (always on the right side of the road) on those nicely paved but strangely narrow roads, everybody on their bikes/rollerblades/walking shoes yells at me?! Once, I even had lady walking her dog give me the finger! People have no manners or common courtesy in this town.

[Dave Burrell]

As in the real world of streets and such- a pedestrian should ALWAYS walk on the opposite side of the street from the wheeled traffic flow...

Having said that - cyclist do HAVE a code of conduct that stipulates that they offer audible warning of their approach... this is NOT a coutesy but a CODE OF CONDUCT...

But having said THAT - -it is incumbent on any approaching person to take actions that would avoid an oncoming person, bike, etc.. and as in the real world of the road-- should that person strike from behind- it would be thier butt on the line, not the the other way around....

some bicyclist think they are elite and rule the trails... we have ways to deal with them.....
Cheers
F500

But since we're talking about small bike paths and not a regular street - if a pedestrian is walking on the opposite side - then they are facing on coming bicyclists directly in their path - that would seem to me to be more dangerous then staying to the right of the path and having the bicyclists go around to the left.

heheh code of conduct - it'd be a good idea but I think 90% of the folks out there have no clue whatsoever about a code of conduct let alone understanding simple respect for others.

as for those elite bicyclists all I can do is hope that a branch doesn't get accidentally shoved in their spokes as they race by.... ooops

Speaking of rude people on those trails, why is it that every time I take my Harley for a nice casual ride through the Parkway (always on the right side of the road) on those nicely paved but strangely narrow roads, everybody on their bikes/rollerblades/walking shoes yells at me?! Once, I even had lady walking her dog give me the finger! People have no manners or common courtesy in this town.

and here I thought they made those small trails for us motorcyclists - I thought maybe it was just a misspelling on the signs that said cyclists only....

I get the same rude gestures - even when I'm trying to do a wheelie to get around them

[tony]

Well, everybody's right and everybody's wrong. Trail etiquette has actually been a hotly-debated topic both within the Sacramento region and nationally. Interestingly, the conclusions of those debates seem to be heading in opposite directions. My experience in numerous states has been that the majority of the trails that do have posted etiquette rules use the pedestrians on the left facing traffic rule, as on roads without sidewalks. However, there are definitely many trails systems out there that dictate that all users stay to the right.

As mentioned by others, the reasons for peds (including joggers) to stay to the left are: 1) conformity with rules of the road, 2) limiting the incidence of bicyclists startling or hitting people from behind by quickly overtaking them from behind and 3) it's safer for everyone being able to see who's coming in their lane.

The major reason for using the rule that everyone stays to the right is simplicity. People have been so completely trained to stay to the right (in hallways, on stairs, in doorways, grocery aisles, etc.) that trying to get them to walk on the left is nearly impossible, unless there is high volume usage that constantly reminds them.

The problems I have with having everyone stay to the right and putting the onus on the cyclists to use a verbal warning when overtaking are twofold: 1) the normal warning, "passing on your left" as often as not results in the walker/jogger moving to the left directly into the cyclist's path, and 2) verbal warning are useless for the high percentage of non-cycling trail users who wear headphones. By the time the cyclist recognizes that the person he/she is about to pass is wearing headphones and has not heard their warning, it's too late to do anything but yell and really startle them.

So, that's the background and my opinion. Here's the facts: the city of Folsom does not have a stated policy on trail etiquette; until recently, the trails in Folsom (outside of the State Park) were not heavily-enough used to worry about it. That is definitely changing. The American River parkway and the East Lake Natoma trails within the city limits are both in the Folsom lake State Recreation Area. The State park etiquette rules merely state a requirement to yield. Everyone yields to horses. Bikes yield to everyone. Everyone else is in the middle. This doesn’t provide any useful direction to walkers and joggers as to which side to use. Finally, the American River Parkway west of Hazel is governed by Sacramento County Parks. Here the rules are quite clear: walkers and joggers are to stay left and use the dirt trail where it is available. This actually works quite well as people generally do stay left in the county portions of the trail, at least where usage is heavy. It’s no wonder people are confused in Folsom.

Because of the confusion, the SACOG Bicycle and Pedestrian Advisory Committee in October of last year came up with a recommended policy to be used region-wide. This policy states:

“Users on wheels – including bicycles, skates, & skateboards - on right. Pedestrians on left facing oncoming bicycle traffic, where there is adequate space pedestrians should use left-hand shoulder. When entering or crossing the trail at uncontrolled points, yield to traffic on the trail. CVC 27400 A person operating a motor vehicle or bicycle may not wear a headset covering, or earplugs in, both ears.

“Riding or walking abreast should be discouraged when the trail is congested. Cyclists and others on wheels - stay to the right, pass on the left and use appropriate hand signals. When passing it is recommended to use audible warnings and make eye contact if possible.”

To my knowledge, this has not been adopted by the local agencies yet, including Folsom. But if I were going to adopt a personal policy where none is stated, I would stay to the left as a runner or walker, and I do.

Interestingly, the Federal Highway Adminstration (an unlikely body to be dealing with trail etiquette) has recently ruled that in a letter regarding a specific trail in Rhode isalnd that all users should stay to the right. The end of this discussion is nowhere in sight.

[keyplayer]

Most of the walkers I pass are blocking the entire lane, sometimes the whole path. I usually can't say "on the left" loud enough for them to hear over headphones and/or conversation, and if they do hear me they tend to go left or split and go to both sides. I hear walkers complain about cyclists but they are bike paths. The scariest thing are small children zig zaging down the path and dogs on leashes with the dog on one side and the person onthe other with the leash streatched across the path. I just try to stay off the path on weekends.

[dukegirl27]

I hear walkers complain about cyclists but they are bike paths. The scariest thing are small children zig zaging down the path and dogs on leashes with the dog on one side and the person onthe other with the leash streatched across the path. I just try to stay off the path on weekends.

I dont think its fair to say that it is specifically for bikers. The trails are for everyones enjoyment. Some bike riders are just very inconsiderate and ride so fast without any warning and this is in a neighborhood setting. Everyone just needs to work together.

[DavidH]

I've heard the Folsom vs state vs county rules and how they're all slightly different. My preference, as a cyclist, is for walkers to walk against traffic (on the left). Announcing your presence to walkers is pretty tough since they're moving much slower than cyclists. I believe it's safer if they just walk on the left and mitigate the entire problem.

I'd be interested in hearing the "walker/jogger" perspective on which they believe to be safer.

[Sandman]

I could care less if the walkers go against or with bike traffic. But they need to PICK ONE! You get on the trails and there are walkers on the left, on the right, all over the place.

Its not really easy to maneuver around these folks when your on a large mountian bike pulling a 60lb toddler trailer.

[s0479]

I've heard the Folsom vs state vs county rules and how they're all slightly different. My preference, as a cyclist, is for walkers to walk against traffic (on the left). Announcing your presence to walkers is pretty tough since they're moving much slower than cyclists. I believe it's safer if they just walk on the left and mitigate the entire problem.

I'd be interested in hearing the "walker/jogger" perspective on which they believe to be safer.

I'm a walker/jogger and generally walk on the left, but on some of the blind turns I may move over to the right because I have no idea what is coming around the corner and some bikes are going so fast, well its an accident waiting to happen!

[Orangetj]

I hear walkers complain about cyclists but they are bike paths.

I don't think that is an accurate statement. As far as I know, those paths are intended for both pedestrians and bicyclists. I've never seen anything denoting those paths as "bicycle paths". The reality is that when bicyclists approach pedestrians, the bicyclist needs to slow down and the pedestrian needs to keep to the side of the path.

[aztransplant]

I don't think that is an accurate statement. As far as I know, those paths are intended for both pedestrians and bicyclists. I've never seen anything denoting those paths as "bicycle paths". The reality is that when bicyclists approach pedestrians, the bicyclist needs to slow down and the pedestrian needs to keep to the side of the path.

On the back of the City of Folsom bike trails map there are "Bike Path Tip" listed:

Many miles of bike paths exist in Folsom and adjacent State of California parks. A bike path differs from a bike lane by being physically separated from city streets and being off limits to motor traffic (with the exception of service or emergency vehicles). Although popular with many cyclists, special precautions need to be taken while riding on these paths:

- "Bike" paths are really multi-use paths. Watch out for pedestrians, joggers, skaters, etc. Their movement may not be as predictable as those of the traffic you may encounter on the road. Keep your speed down and pass other users with caution and by saying, "Hi, I'm passing on your left."

- Because motorists often ignore or are unaware of cyclists on bike paths, you must take special care when entering intersections to ensure that you are seen by all traffic.